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delano Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009 Posts: 3118 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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There are in fact two different questions:
BEST VINTAGE CORNETS FOR THE MONEY?
Best cornets for the money? Most undervalued?
Not necessarily the same, my answers on question one will be different from them on question two.
Then the question: what for? It's not true that a cornet is a cornet.
But if you just want a cornet of great value for little money, buy an older Yamaha 2310 or 2330. More upmarket: almost all second hand pro cornets are great value cause of a disfunctioning market for these instruments. |
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joe1joey Regular Member
Joined: 15 Oct 2010 Posts: 78 Location: Eastern Panhandle WV
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Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:51 am Post subject: |
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Noting I agree with some opinions I will leave that area alone. Just like to add a couple of fine players I do not recall mention of;
Vega Pre-war Power Model cornet
Reynolds Professional cornet in both brass and in silver bell (prefer brass) *
Holton model 28 cornet and 29 quite different and both exquisite
I do not know the current valuations, but within the past 5 years have purchased a number of each in very fine condition (and consistent specimens) between $75 to $100 each. _________________ AKA ww2navyman |
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Abraxas Veteran Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Posts: 345 Location: London, Canada
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for turning me on to 80A's although my wife might never forgive you. Since buying my first one, about 3 months ago, I now have 5 :>) I'll keep a trumpet around maybe, but have pretty much sold every other horn I own. I just can't believe these. And Jeez the prices !! Perfectly in tune all over the stunning range .... PERFECTLY. Dynamic range from a whisper to blowing the windows out. Gorgeous tone with my Curry MPC... an odd ball shallow cup. I have samples from 2017 to the 60's and they are all fantastic. I would only ask if there are better horns, for under $1000, please tell me. This I gotta play !! |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:16 am Post subject: |
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Abraxas wrote: | Thanks for turning me on to 80A's although my wife might never forgive you. Since buying my first one, about 3 months ago, I now have 5 :>) I'll keep a trumpet around maybe, but have pretty much sold every other horn I own. I just can't believe these. And Jeez the prices !! Perfectly in tune all over the stunning range .... PERFECTLY. Dynamic range from a whisper to blowing the windows out. Gorgeous tone with my Curry MPC... an odd ball shallow cup. I have samples from 2017 to the 60's and they are all fantastic. I would only ask if there are better horns, for under $1000, please tell me. This I gotta play !! |
I love my 80A's. But they never feel intimate to me. There's something about the closeness of a classic cornet shape that makes it feel part of me. Yes, the 80A does it all, but for playing in a quiet setting, a bunch of others fit better. See list below for examples. _________________ Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9361 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:47 am Post subject: |
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I recently sold my '54 80A. I never played it...sold it to someone (a jazz guy) who will. In my opinion, it was sort of a hybrid cornet/trumpet, but the groups I play in need either one or the other, not a compromise. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham
Last edited by Dale Proctor on Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:28 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Abraxas Veteran Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Posts: 345 Location: London, Canada
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:15 am Post subject: |
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Funny about a stated preference for other cornets in "quieter situations". Maybe its the mouthpiece but my combo would make Chet sound like Maynard. Mind you I found that more with the 1917 Victor New Wonder. It goes down to a whisper. And yes it is easily mistook for a trumpet but I still hear the cornet sound. I just love it's tunability and perfect slotting. I'll put it this way , I do not deserve anything better. |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:30 am Post subject: |
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Abraxas wrote: | Funny about a stated preference for other cornets in "quieter situations". Maybe its the mouthpiece but my combo would make Chet sound like Maynard. Mind you I found that more with the 1917 Victor New Wonder. It goes down to a whisper. And yes it is easily mistook for a trumpet but I still hear the cornet sound. I just love it's tunability and perfect slotting. I'll put it this way , I do not deserve anything better. |
I totally get it. I was playing with a small jazz group and playing very quietly. I asked somebody watching what they thought. Their comment was I was too loud for the band. And the bass and banjo were amplified. Maybe I just can't play softly? After that I switched to my Cleveland cornet and problem solved. I used same mouthpiece for both situations. Even the King Silvertone, though brighter than some cornets, doesn't project quite so vigorously as the 80A. _________________ Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8914 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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Abraxas wrote: | Thanks for turning me on to 80A's although my wife might never forgive you. Since buying my first one, about 3 months ago, I now have 5 :>) I'll keep a trumpet around maybe, but have pretty much sold every other horn I own. I just can't believe these. And Jeez the prices !! Perfectly in tune all over the stunning range .... PERFECTLY. Dynamic range from a whisper to blowing the windows out. Gorgeous tone with my Curry MPC... an odd ball shallow cup. I have samples from 2017 to the 60's and they are all fantastic. I would only ask if there are better horns, for under $1000, please tell me. This I gotta play !! |
I've got an 80A from the 20's if I'm not mistaken. It's a little rough and really needs a replacement leadpipe. After that, I'll need to score a mouthpiece with the appropriate shank. When time and $ allow. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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Abraxas Veteran Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Posts: 345 Location: London, Canada
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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cheiden wrote: | Abraxas wrote: | Thanks for turning me on to 80A's although my wife might never forgive you. Since buying my first one, about 3 months ago, I now have 5 :>) I'll keep a trumpet around maybe, but have pretty much sold every other horn I own. I just can't believe these. And Jeez the prices !! Perfectly in tune all over the stunning range .... PERFECTLY. Dynamic range from a whisper to blowing the windows out. Gorgeous tone with my Curry MPC... an odd ball shallow cup. I have samples from 2017 to the 60's and they are all fantastic. I would only ask if there are better horns, for under $1000, please tell me. This I gotta play !! |
I've got an 80A from the 20's if I'm not mistaken. It's a little rough and really needs a replacement leadpipe. After that, I'll need to score a mouthpiece with the appropriate shank. When time and $ allow. |
Can you tell me the issue with the shank as I have been using standard cornet shanks from Curry ? The only time i have run into old shank size issues is with Olds... prior to about '54. |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9361 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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Up until around 1958, Conn cornet mouthpiece shanks and receivers had a slightly different taper from what is standard today. More modern mouthpieces won't seat fully without a bit of force or a twist. If an old Conn has had modern mouthpieces used on it quite a lot, the receiver will become reamed and/or stretched so that modern mouthpiece tapers fit. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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Abraxas Veteran Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Posts: 345 Location: London, Canada
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting. Thanks. |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8914 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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Abraxas wrote: | Can you tell me the issue with the shank as I have been using standard cornet shanks from Curry ? The only time i have run into old shank size issues is with Olds... prior to about '54. |
https://cderksen.home.xs4all.nl/ConnArticle34.html
http://www.currympc.com/index.php?id=49
"Special Shanks
Any of the above mouthpieces can be ordered in the oversize Olds shank or the new Conn short cornet for a small additional charge.
NEW!! Conn short cornet blank now available! Pre-1958 (serial numbers less than 700,00) Conn cornet afficianados can now order their favorite Curry cornet cup in the correct size for these popular cornets. At 2.5" long with the correct 60 thousandths/inch taper (and correct shank diameter) these vintage cornets speak easier with better intonation! Thanks to Rick Henrickson of NYC and Alan Hancock (UK) for their insightful help and research." _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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veery715 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 4313 Location: Ithaca NY
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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I've a Holton cornet with a double loop in the leadpipe. It's a nice player albeit a bit bright.
I have a King Silversonic from the 40s. Also a nice player and a bit bright.
I have a York Professional from about 1920, a bit less bright than the others.
And a 1947 Buescher Custom which plays great and is darkest of the bunch. _________________ veery715
Hear me sing!: https://youtu.be/vtJ14MV64WY
Playing trumpet - the healthy way to blow your brains out. |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
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Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | And a 1947 Buescher Custom which plays great and is darkest of the bunch. |
Oh man, I've got to get one of those.
Tell me more. What's the response like? Valves? Intonation? Comfort in the hand? Mouthpiece requirements? More please. _________________ Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
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veery715 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 4313 Location: Ithaca NY
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Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:32 am Post subject: |
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Richard III wrote: | Quote: | And a 1947 Buescher Custom which plays great and is darkest of the bunch. |
Oh man, I've got to get one of those.
Tell me more. What's the response like? Valves? Intonation? Comfort in the hand? Mouthpiece requirements? More please. |
It is very easy to hold and has good enough intonation for small combo work. I use any of my standard taper mouthpieces, but tend lately to a CG7 which I think may be Kanstul made. It also likes my Stork 4A+, but that makes it really, really dark.
Not as dark as my Wild Thing Short Cornet though. _________________ veery715
Hear me sing!: https://youtu.be/vtJ14MV64WY
Playing trumpet - the healthy way to blow your brains out. |
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Goldplate Veteran Member
Joined: 14 Sep 2004 Posts: 152
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Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:22 am Post subject: |
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Sturmbill wrote: | Before Dale Proctor says it: Conn 5A
Yamaha 233 or 2330 (not 2330II)
And a third vote for the Conn 80A
Bill |
Oh, if only I had read this before I bought a 2330II. |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2655 Location: Anacortes, WA
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Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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I wish I'd never sold my Holton Galaxy. Such a sweet sounding cornet. I highly recommend it to all if you don't have to worry about projection. Perfect for a small venue. _________________ Richard
King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece |
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Tim80 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Nov 2001 Posts: 1415
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Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:58 pm Post subject: Boston 3 Star |
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I keep coming back to Boston 3 Star cornets. I've had several. I just bought another. It has mouth pipes as well as 3 tuning slides. I had a fixed leadpipe model that was so much fun. I regret selling it. _________________ All murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers and to the sound of trumpets.
Voltaire
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Abraxas Veteran Member
Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Posts: 345 Location: London, Canada
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Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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Just got 2 Martin Indianas in the mail for Christmas. Awesome ! Perfect intonation, stellar range and dynamics that go from a whisper to thunder all in a feather light package. Funny I had a stuck slide on one so I was giving it light taps with a rubber mallet and it was ringing like a bell. |
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