OK ---- but what does a cornet sound like?

sparxII · Veteran Member Joined: 09 Oct 2002 Posts: 216

Many of you will want to hear some very fine cornet playing. In my 'sound room' (www.sparxmusic.com) you can hear Norman Engel playing cornet solos by Clarke,Arban and Staigers.

He is playing on a Bach 184L with a Sparx 2B and on the Arban a Sparx 2.

Cheers,
Ted

[ This Message was edited by: sparxII on 2003-10-20 15:32 ]

OldKid · Veteran Member Joined: 04 Sep 2003 Posts: 135

Absolutely beautiful,
If I buy your mp I'm gonna sound like that, right? Just kidding

I think I'm gonna ask Santa for a 2B
_________________
Bach 181 Strad Cornet B1.5B
YAMAHA Xeno 16C4 GP
Getzen 3850 Cornet YAM 16E
King (early 50's) Super 20 B1.5C
Pocket Max B1.5C
Arban's

jamesfrmphilly · Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 5:05 am Post subject:

what's needed is to play the same thing back to back on trumpet and then on cornet.
_________________
1946 Martin Committee, Bach 5V

trumpetmike · Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 7:42 am Post subject:

I have met very few true cornet players who play the trumpet, so it would be a very different comparison to make.

I also think it depends what sort of cornet playing you are after - you have the classic UK brass band style, the US brass band, the dixie cornet - what sort of sound are we thinking of for our "cornet" sound?
For me, I always think of the warmth of Philip McCann's sound (and yes, I do know that not everyone likes the vibrato!!) or that of Roger Webster. They can play all of the technical stuff, but it all sounds absolutely gorgeous.

ARB · Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2003 7:11 am Post subject:

Ted, those are some great sound clips, Norman Engel is fantastic. Man, I’m really enjoying this cornet sound, but which of the Sparx mpcs would you suggest someone purchase who is new to cornets and who wants to achieve that nice mellow cornet sound?

I wanna' sould like Norman Engel on the Fantaisie Brillant clip.

_________________
Allen - 'Chops-in-Hotlanta'

Schilke S22
80 Yamaha 732 Cornet
77 LA Benge
54 Olds Recording

"It's what we think we know that keeps us from knowing"

[ This Message was edited by: ARB on 2003-10-15 10:16 ]

oj · Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2003 8:31 am Post subject:

Have you heard Martin Winter?

http://www.4barsrest.com/reviews/cds/cdrev087.asp

This is a guy who can play cornet like a cornet and trumpet like a trumpet.
Lot's of players today (brought up on trumpet) sound too "trumpetish" on cornet.

Here'se a funny little personal experience:
I play along with Vizzutti ("Arban meets Vizzutti") from time to time. Then one day I read more carefully about the recording - Wow, done with a Yamaha Cornet. I had been thinking it was a trumpet he played.

Martin Winter has his background in the British Brass Band tradition, so that is part of the reason he plays so nice on cornet. He also sound good on flugel, btw.

With a trumpet-like mpc. on cornet it is of course more difficult to sound like a cornet, but most of it is IMO in the head of the player. You have to have a "cornet sound" in your head to create one.

Ole

softcase · Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 8:49 am Post subject:

ooh, this is most excellent, it's always a pleasure to hear Norman play.
I noticed at the most recent Hannaford Street Silver Band concert that almost the whole cornet section was using your mouthpieces!
You guys sounded excellent, as always.
I shall be in touch with you Ted, I think I may want to purchase a 2.

Jim_K · Regular Member Joined: 05 Nov 2002 Posts: 78

It troubles me that today many people are unaware what a cornet sounds like. When the subject is raise at all, most often the British brass bands are spoken of.

There is nothing wrong with this- and I love the music of the BBB's but -

There is a living tradition of American cornet. It is not ancient history. I am not the only one who plays cornet as my instrument of choice - and there are many others who maintain active careers using cornet. This is not ancient history.

Consider what, where and when the great touring and non-touring bands played. Even Herseth played cornet at one time, as well as Phil. Smith. There is a lyricism and style that is not easily learned without playing the literature of the cornet solo. It is closely related to the Bel Canto style of singing. The Russian trumpeters refer to Maurice Andre as a cornetist. There is a reason for this.
_________________
Dr. James L. Klages
Profesor of Trumpet
School of Music
University of Central Oklahoma
Edmond, OK 73034

former cornet soloist - "The President's Own" U.S. Marine Band

Mr. Stomvi · Heavyweight Member Joined: 01 Apr 2002 Posts: 1062

You are right Jim - When talking cornet I always think of the French and American schools first. The Brits for current brass banding yes - but for solo cornet literature - gotta go with the Frogs or Yanks. My continuing cornet inspiration and what got me into playing cornet in the first place has always been the Maurice Andre album "La Belle Epoch". I never get tired of listening to it (to my wife's displeasure)

. His version of Carnival and Fantasie Brilliant are truly unique and my favorites except every time I play these at his tempos (really slow and stylized) everybody gives me funny looks like "what the hell is he playing those so slow for - this guy has no clue". I also love his version of Petit's "Myrto Polka" but I can't find the sheet music for it anywhere. Would love to do it with a band but so far no luck. Gotta also love Andre's flugel version af La Traviata. What a tone. Light but gauzy, mossy. Oooooooooooo !

Seth Moore

_________________
The "Flattergrub" or literally the "uncouth flutter" was the very descriptive term that the Germans had for the pedal tones. Apparently some players could produce a "Flattergrub" and nothing more.

Richard I. Schwartz
"The Cornet Compendium"

[ This Message was edited by: Mr. Stomvi on 2003-10-20 23:59 ]

trumpetmike · Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 11:38 pm Post subject:

All of the styles mentioned are "correct cornet sound," it's just a question of which you prefer. I happen to prefer the classic UK brass band cornet sound, but that is probably down to where I live and where I was brought up.

We do have a huge number of cornet solos that have been written over here, but you tend to only find them being played in the UK brass bands. A lot of them don't work with piano accompaniments so they are rarely used in recitals. Some music just doesn't seem to travel too well.

OJ - Martin Winter - oh yes!
The exception that proves the rule?

The joy of having a cornet forum is that we can actually discuss the differences of the different national schools of cornet playing. I quite like hearing Maurice Andre playing cornet, I am a fan of the US cornet school, I just happen to prefer the sound of the UK one. You would never get the trumpet players agreeing on which trumpet sound they prefer (US, UK French, German, Russian - and many more besides) so why should we come to a concensus on the cornet?

GordonH · Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 12:36 pm Post subject:

Controversial:

UK brass band players do not play those old solos.
They are more likely to be playing test pieces by people like Peter Graham or swing and light music arrangements.

The UK brass band sound is therfore more trumpet like than those outside that circle would expect given historical precedence.

Gordon

trumpetmike · Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:19 pm Post subject:

GordonH - where do you get your information from?
Whereabouts are you from? Have you played with any UK brass bands?
I know a huge number of bands that still use the older style solos.
Yes, bands play test pieces, but these tend not to be for concerts, but for the contests.
As for the lighter side of music, yes they play swing type arrangements, but the sound (if they are a good band!) remains that of cornets rather than trumpets.

If you are interested in how brass bands have developed (sound wise) the Origin of the Species CD, recorded by the Wallace Collection, is well worth checking out.
All recorded on period (1840) instruments. Fascinating to hear the contrasts between the instrumentation used then (keyed bugles and ophicleides alongside early valved instruments) and now. The music is all from the CyFarthfa Castle collection. Well worth searching out.

vic · Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 2:08 pm Post subject:

I'd like for someone to outline these various "cornet schools": UK brass band, American, French, et al. What are the distinctives of each?

And is it possible to give examples of players or pieces to enhance the descriptions?

I am having fun with my cornet I got this year. Most all of us played cornet in the 60's where I lived, so that puts me in the marching band/concert band "school". It is interesting that some regions in our state predominantly use cornets in their school bands. Maybe it is part of a resurgence.

Tom K. · Veteran Member Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 483

I agree we could use an outline of the various schools. Also, what is the "Italian School" sound?