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How long does it take to come back?



 
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OldHorn
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:34 am    Post subject: How long does it take to come back? Reply with quote

Just wondering what type time frame comeback players have experienced.

I was a session player and played shows for different artists. I put the horn down in the mid-90's and put my energies to arranging and orchestration instead.

Now at 64, I just started playing flugel again, not trumpet. I started out practicing 15 minutes a day and am slowly increasing that. I'd like to get to a place where I can play melodies comfortably in the staff, maybe an occasional G above the staff.

How long did it take you to reach that point? 6 months, a year, more?
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I learned a long time ago that it's individual. How long does it take? As long as it takes.

But one thing is important to your question is that is how efficient was your breathing and how solid was your embouchure was before.

It sounds like you were doing well, so just make sure you don't take it any quicker than you have to. In other words, don't be (destructively) impatient.
And make sure you have good breathing and breath support.
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WxJeff
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personal experience:

Background: decent high school player who didn't really apply himself, put the horn down for 25 years, now back 12 or so.

90 days: etudes/melodies within the staff as you described, top of the staff G ok but not effortless. Wife allowed me out of the basement

six months: did an embouchure change with a local pro / teacher. Affected range development but was definitely a short term sacrifice for long term gain.

one year: able to play 2nd part for 90 minute church orchestra practice at which time chops are gone. range up to Bb above the staff. Better musicianship than ever in high school due to maturity / group with which I was playing.

Endurance is still the challenge, and honestly I don't practice nearly as much as some of the other guys who will post.
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SSmith1226
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am 69 years old two years into my comeback after a 44 year layoff. I played for 16 years before my layoff started and was always an amateur. It took me six months to get to a G above the staff and at one year I could squeal out C above the staff. At two years, D above the staff,in the privacy of my home,is reliable.. As part of my daily routine, I play two octive scales in all keys and can generally squeal out F above high C and on several occasions have squeezed out notes as high as double high C. Currently the notes above D above the staff are not usable. I play 2nd and 3rd trumpet in community Bands, and have helped out in first trumpet when the position was thin. At one and one half years into my comeback I found myself playing Principal Trumpet in a series of orchestra concerts in St. Petersburg, Russia due to illness of the Principal Trumpet Player. That was an interesting experience playing in Marinski Concert Hall as well as other venues, but needless to say my playing was not up to that standard.
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KRELL1960
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:03 pm    Post subject: Re: How long does it take to come back? Reply with quote

OldHorn wrote:
Just wondering what type time frame comeback players have experienced.

I was a session player and played shows for different artists. I put the horn down in the mid-90's and put my energies to arranging and orchestration instead.

Now at 64, I just started playing flugel again, not trumpet. I started out practicing 15 minutes a day and am slowly increasing that. I'd like to get to a place where I can play melodies comfortably in the staff, maybe an occasional G above the staff.

How long did it take you to reach that point? 6 months, a year, more?



hey old,
It doesn't take long, to play G on top of the staff, If you were a sessions player, your should still be able to do that, maybe not as good as you once did, but a g on top of the staff should be within a month at the longest. As a session player you must have had a daily routine. somehting you did day in and day out, no matter what. thats all you have to do again to get your chops back. For me its a variation on a Bill Adam routine that always gets me back. Lately because of work, i have almost 0 time on the horn, a couple of days of my daily routine, brings everything back, up to F# above high c, and i was never a session player, so this will be cake for you. Do your routine everyday, and you'll be rippin' in no time at all.

regards,

tom
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gwood66
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am amateur who stopped playing following high school and took it up again at 49. I am a little over 2 years in to my comeback. Here is my approximately timeline:

- Practiced aimlessly for the first couple of months and had to strain for anything above 3rd space C.
- Started taking lessons and had a solid G on the staff by 6 months.
- By 9 months I could reliable play a high C.
- By the one year point I could play as high as a G above High C.

There is an article David Brown on the ITG website that describes what to expect during a comeback. I found it to be pretty accurate based on m experience.

http://trumpetguild.org/pedagogy/category/8-articles-and-essays
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OldHorn
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks everybody for your replies. I do appreciate it.

I started back a month ago and things have improved greatly since that first night I put the horn to my chops. It's just very frustrating, I can feel the notes inside, but the muscles aren't strong enough to play what I hear.

Still, the time frames that you've experienced, make me feel better. I've agreed to a project in June where I'll be playing the flugel. Still, I'll be writing the charts so I can write around my limitations if need be. For me it's helpful to set goals and this one feels doable.
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GeorgeB
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just don't rush things. I played for 12 years ( 1953-65 ) then didn't play again until March 2016. I'm in my eighties so the face muscles aren't the ones I played with back in the day. It took me about 7 months ( 90 minute practice every morning and 60 minutes playing tunes in the afternoon ) to get to the point where I could join and play first chair with a local community band. I was playing a comfortable high C by month 5 and now can add a couple more notes to that. I purposely play music with lots of top line Fs , as well as Gs and As above the staff. Endurance has gone from 20 minutes to well over an hour but still has a way to go. Two octave lip slurs have helped me get where I am as far as endurance goes. It all takes time and tenacity but you can do it if you really want to.
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ButchA
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

George is absolutely correct... Don't rush things!

As seen in that rambling video that I made (see the thread about my comeback player video), it takes while to redevelop your embouchure and get your chops back. I started it out school band in the late 60's and well into the 70's. Then sadly my trumpet fell by the wayside as I was drawn more towards loud rock 'n roll and electric guitar playing.

Once my daughters got into school band (woodwinds) in the 90's, I got my trumpet back out. I took me about 6 months to get back into playing semi-decent. I could only hit the G at the top of the staff and that was it. I knew well enough not to push it, so I gradually worked my way back over the following years.

Another thing I learned real quick is that a new mouthpiece can really help with being a "comeback player". I can't play on a 7C or anything smaller like a 10ĹC or something like that. They don't work for me. I have to have something larger around the 3C size. But then that's just me.... What works for me, might not work for you, but it might be worth a try.
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Rod Haney
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Started 2.5 years ago after 47 years off and had a g 1st time I played. But Iíve been working the last 30 months getting that hi G I usedta have and its still not there all the time. I work fairly hard and do exercises by all the usual suspects. Seems youíve just forgotten some things you used to know, if you just do corner and tongue level and breathing exercises while just getting back to playing you should get over this quickly. In my case much of the info available now is new to me and I just take what I can make work and crap can the rest.
Good luck
Rod
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INTJ
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I played from 5th grade to High School. When I started High School in 1975 I was put on a Bach 1.5C and taught to play with a flat chin embochure, which killed all my range above the staff. My senior of HS year I switched to French Horn and spent my freshmen year as a music major on Horn at Univ of Oregon. Horn wasnít what I wanted to do I quit music all together and became a USAF pilotómy original dream.

The summer of 2001, while still active duty USAF, I came back to trumpet. I knew what didnít work for meóbig MPs and a flat chin so I started researching. Was immediately able to play to High C but had no tone, endurance, and did not play in tune. In 2002 I played second trumpet in a church praise bandóbadly. In 2003 I discovered Pops and took my first lesson from him.

In 2006 I finally played a High G but I still struggled with intonation. In 2008 I started playing in a community jazz band and started taking lessons from a local pro. I improved in jazz style and reading. My local teacher was great with everything except teaching range and endurance, but I still had Pops for that. I went through a disasterous time in 2008 trying to make Monette MPs work to me. Sometime around 2009 I went to Wedge MPs and havenít looked back. I stayed playing lead in my jazz band and I started performing High Gs in 2010 or 2011. I still had intonation issues above the staff. I had a lesson with Roger Ingram in 2012 and picked up some important tips, th biggest being was his emphasis on tusting my projection and not overblowing.

I started downsizing my MPs and started a search for the right trumpet. Each step smaller in MP improved my playing. Most advice I had received on trumpets was wrong for me and I finally settled on Flip Oakes Wild Things by 2012. It was then I was able to play in tune across my entire range.

In 2015 I performed double high Cs a few times at the end of Count Bubba. I also performed the Send in the Clowns solo from Kenton Ď76. In 2017 I performed the high Solos from Maynardís McArthur Park.

I am still an amateur hack. My first attempts at both the Clowns Solo and McArthur were rough but I did improve. I still need to work on my lead style, learn to read better, and learn to improvise.

On the good side I no longer fight the trumpet. I am able to diagnose what happens mechanics wise when things fall off. I consider myslf a solid High G/A AMATUER player who ocassionally gets a double C. I can do all that for around two hours of endurance. I practice about two hours in the evening when I donít have a gig or a rehearsal. That is all the time I have available since I still have a full-time job.

I donít think a player has to take as long as I didó14 years to performing DHC. I think someone willing to study and learn HOW to practice and who is willing to devote two hours a day could get there in half the time or less. Conversely, if one thinks that mindlessly playing the trumpet will get them anywhere, they better just get lucky and happen to do things right.
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gmorrell
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My first post as a member.
After a 20 year break I picked up horn and started in at age 48. This site was very helpful. I still do not have the high school high chops I once did but that was not my goal starting back up.
Patience, consistent practice schedule, playing with others of all levels has helped me , always with room for improvement.
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cbtj51
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After 14 years of not playing, I am now 3 1/2 years into playing daily again after retirement from my day gig. The first few weeks back were difficult just getting my head back in the game. I am a Type IV A (upstream) player, so actually producing a good sound seemed to fall right back in place. Range was never a real problem and hasn't caused any problems this time out. Everything above High C up to G works consistently, pretty much like when I was much younger and now with more intelligent pacing and playing, my lower range is very consistent as well. Getting back into the habit of regular and, more importantly, intelligent, effective practice was the real roadblock. I was thrust (semi-voluntarily) back into public performance within the first few weeks. More nerve inducing than I would have thought. Much trial and error and finally making a connection with a local Symphony player got me back on path. I began playing and traveling along side this very enthusiastic player in many venues with her keeping me very involved in Brass Ensemble, Chamber Orchestra, Symphony Orchestra, Concert Band, the whole kit and caboodle, anything and almost everything that she played in. Playing this style of trumpet was different for me since my previous experience was Big Bands, Latin Bands, R&B and Top 40 Bands for many decades. We talked trumpet and technique as well as getting to be friends. Our Spouses got to be friends as well so a social component came into play that keeps us connected in non performing roles, though we still end up talking shop a lot.

My comeback has been scary, pleasing, thought provoking, knowledge building, but mostly, very active physically, mentally and musically challenging in my older years. The performances and relationships are most rewarding and I have gained immensely from the experience. Hope that every Comeback Player finds it as rewarding as I have.

Mike
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ehammarlund
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

After 12 solid years on and 25 year off, I'm just getting back into it. It's been a couple of weeks; I can only hold practices for ~20 minutes. No problems at all with in-staff C or D; E's fine as a "drive-by" but not reliable for longer tones; tone decreases considerably as I go up and I can't quitehit G yet.
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OldKing
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I picked it back up a couple of year ago, I just assumed it'd take the rest of my life.
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 6:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's probably break even for me right now. I'm not great on high notes, but never was. I have less stamina and am having breathing problems. But I also feel like a reset embouchure has been good for me, I have more of a sense of tone and rhythm and am better able to concentrate during practice. I'm less competitive and just enjoy playing more.
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