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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:24 am Post subject: Berkeleywinds C Flugelhorn thingy |
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So, I am an overenthusiastic returnee who loves novelty...
I saw that Berkeleywinds makes a C Flugelhorn that has been met some (probably justifiable) derision. I can get one here for ~$400, which is a bit off of the US listprice.
I 90% won't get it, but my question is, with something like this could I just play along with a the melody line in a hymnbook. Right now I have a C pocket trumpet that I'm enthusiastic about, and I wonder if I could use it in a similar way. I probably won't do this, but if I had the chance to try out several live and pick the best I wonder if it might be worth it. http://berkeleywind.com/c-bass-flugelhorn.html?viewfullsite=1
Another barrier for something like this is that I probably could not get a mute, which may be necessary for me to play something like it here. |
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Dennis78 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2015 Posts: 673 Location: Cincinnati
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:30 am Post subject: |
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So far I’ve had good luck with Chinese made budget instruments. I’d say go for it. And yes, you could play directly out of a hymnal _________________ a few different ones |
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dstpt Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 1286
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:06 am Post subject: |
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Yes, you could play directly from a hymnal without having to transpose, but this is a C Bass Flugelhorn, so it will play an octave lower and take a trombone/euphonium-size mouthpiece, which will be a notable change from the C pocket trumpet mouthpiece. Also, FYI, it has rotary valves. |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:27 am Post subject: |
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Hmmm, I like that you are talking this up It would be a fun one-man-show horn. Odds are still against it, but if my used Bb trumpet purchase doesn't work out and I could actually try this out in person it could be a fun instrument. |
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Brad361 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 7080 Location: Houston, TX.
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:18 am Post subject: |
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I don’t know....Asian made (I KNOW that doesn’t necessarily mean “junk”, but it does in some cases), Asian made rotary valves.... . 🤔
Personally I would pass.
Brad _________________ When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8914 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:01 am Post subject: |
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You're not likely going to be playing the melody line with a bass horn. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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Andy Del Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 2665 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:13 am Post subject: |
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A front facing euphonium / baritone in C. Move on and find something useful to play, this is not it.
For playing from a hymnal, if you must use a C instrument, just play the pocket trumpet or a C trumpet, there is no reason to go an octave lower at all. It just as easy to transpose at sight and be more useful. Our school has a chapel band and my grade 4 kids transpose hymns and other worship songs every week. This is on not only trumpet, but also clarinet and alto sax. And they play bass clef part at times as well.
cheers
Andy _________________ so many horns, so few good notes... |
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LittleRusty Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 12664 Location: Gardena, Ca
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:55 am Post subject: |
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Andy Del wrote: | A front facing euphonium / baritone in C. Move on and find something useful to play, this is not it.
For playing from a hymnal, if you must use a C instrument, just play the pocket trumpet or a C trumpet, there is no reason to go an octave lower at all. |
Andy, I respectfully disagree on this particular point. There are many who like the sound of the trombone/baritone as a solo instrument for hymns.
One recent Church Musical Minister I played for often used trombones for this. I felt he was being kind of a traitor, since he was a former professional trumpet player himself. |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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This is a good point. I need to learn to transcribe. I maybe should just get a flugelhorn and learn to transcribe if that's what I want to do. I looked at some online videos but need to dedicate some time to this. One of the dilemmas for those of us who are non-pros and only occasional players is that building up the regular musical skills (transcription, writing descants or punching up music, truly learning to double) take time. |
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Brad361 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 7080 Location: Houston, TX.
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel wrote: | This is a good point. I need to learn to transcribe. I maybe should just get a flugelhorn and learn to transcribe if that's what I want to do. I looked at some online videos but need to dedicate some time to this. One of the dilemmas for those of us who are non-pros and only occasional players is that building up the regular musical skills (transcription, writing descants or punching up music, truly learning to double) take time. |
It is a good idea to learn how to transpose, but it’s not totally necessary, if you are more of a hobbyist (and I am not implying that there is anything wrong with that). If you don’t want to play a C instrument, I would think writing the melodies from a hymnal for Bb trumpet (all you need to do
is write it up a whole step) could not take long.
My problem with the bass trumpet you were considering was mostly the good chance of getting an instrument that you will have to fight to get the results you want.
I know from teaching kids in their first few years of playing that while they certainly don’t need a 2800.00 horn, one that plays terribly can really handicap them.
Brad _________________ When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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It's funny, but when I was doing violin with the kids, I learned that almost all string instruments are made in China now, and the biggest problem is the last stage "set up." So for strings now, often there are quite excellent instruments produced out of China, but you may need to have a professional cut a new bridge, check the nut, and put on new strings.
I suspect an instrument like this is similar. In the main review that circulates of this C flugelhorn, the reviewer said he added a spit valve, shortened the pipes for the tuning slide, and got a better mouthpiece, and then it was a pretty good instrument.
Transposing shouldn't be hard to learn, but I'd probably need someone to walk me through it. |
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Brassnose Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Mar 2016 Posts: 2053 Location: Germany
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Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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I know this is an old thread but out of personal interest I’m bringing it up again. As I wrote in another thread I have gotten into bass trumpet about 4 years ago and I really like the trumpet/bass trumpet combo (also for church stuff, as discussed before). Moreover, as I have the inverse personality of a cliché lead player I actually enjoy the fact that I am not in the center of attention the whole time with the bass trumpet.
So here is an observation and a question: my Chinese bass trumpet is pretty solid but the be great I would need a tech working on some points, notably cleaning and adjusting the (rotary) valves a little plus adding a few water keys. This can be done and overall the instrument would still be lower in cost than a pro instrument (which I’d love to have but can’t afford right now). As a result, I would not totally disregard these instruments, even in C - people working long day jobs have other boundary conditions than pro musicians and students when adding skills to their portfolio.
Question to the OP and others: has anyone tested the bass flugel in C linked above? Whaddya all think about it after playing? _________________ 2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't even remember posting this, but I am the OP! I did not buy the instrument, which I hadn't realized was an octave lower. I ended up buying a mix of instruments, including some Bb trumpets, a Taiwanese flugabone and a good flugelhorn. This must have been in my first months back as a comeback player.
I also learned to transpose, which is much easier than I thought it would be, and on Easter I played my Bb trumpet with no problem. Brassnose, if I were you I'd either buy a flugelhorn or keep an eye out for very inexpensive, used marching instruments, since they are fun and cheap. I also like the idea of a less strident instrument, but I will say that churches often want a nice bright trumpet and the marching instruments have a reputation for iffy tuning (including presumably the Berkeleywinds.
Much gratitude to all of you who helped steer me well coming back to brass. |
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HaveTrumpetWillTravel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: East Asia
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Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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The marketplace has a used C bass flugelhorn listed now (Jinbao). You could write to the store and see their advice on the instrument also. |
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Brassnose Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Mar 2016 Posts: 2053 Location: Germany
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 6:43 am Post subject: |
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Well, I can transpose the easy stuff, I do this with the small trumpet group (where I use the bass trumpet). It does get confusing at times because some things are in treble clef and some are in bass clef, so there is an additional twist.
I already have a very good flugel so I am all set there.
The bass flugel in the marketplace is what triggered my interest again, but having it sent to Europe plus customs … _________________ 2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier |
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