Comeback Range Goal

[jbrobert]

My mother-in-law is visiting from Japan. So, when the U.S. Marine Band gave a concert recently dedicated to 150th anniversary of Sousa's birth, we attended, my thought being, "Now, that's something you won't see in Japan". It also got me thinking about playing the cornet again, which I hadn't done in 28 years. I played starting at age 8 through HS. Been so long, I can't even remember if I was any good or not.

In the interim, I've played guitar quite a bit, with a focus on bluegrass/flatpicking.

So I visited ebay, bought an Olds Ambassador ca. 1960 or so. This got here about a week ago. I was surprised at how comfortable and familiar a cornet felt in my hands, since I don't believe I've ever picked one up in the intervening years.

I'm keeping my practice sessions very short, but wondering on what to focus? Out of the box, like the first time I picked it up, I could play a 4th space E pretty reliably, a G above the staff with some struggle while fresh.

I don't want to obsess on range (any more than I want to obsess on speed on guitar), but been away from the instrument so long, I'm wondering what is a good working range to shoot for over the next, say, six months?

thanks!

Jay

[_swthiel]

Hmmmm ... tricky ...

I think you're right not to obsess about range. Let me suggest a couple of things to think about:

How do you sound? I'd set sound goals rather than range goals, at least initally. Use your entire range when you practice (I find that for me it's use it or lose it!) and stretch yourself.

What do you want to be able to perform?

Focus on the fundamentals in your technique -- good sound, clear attacks, clean fingering, excellent intonation, and having all these traits through your entire dynamic range.

Find a teacher. I really regret not doing that when I started my comeback in earnest! A competent teacher can help you calibrate your expectations and guide you.

Welcome back to the playing world, keep us posted on how it's coming!

Steve
_________________
Steve Thiel

Matthew 25:31-46

[INTJ]

In HS I could not play above the staff but had great tone. I came back 2 years ago from a 20+ year layoff from all brass and a 23 year layoff from the trumpet. My inital goal was just a High C. That came quickly. The difference for me was playing with a closed embochure vs the open embochure I used in HS.

You will likely get a good sound a little sooner with an open embochure, but most likely you will not devlop any range. When the embochure is open, it is for many hard to get the lips compressed enough to vibrate at higher frequencies without a lot of pressure. Such is the danger for many of foucsing only on sound.

Today, two years after my come back and a year after starting lessons with Pops (http://www.bbtrumpet.com/index.html), I routinely play to G/A above High C in most of my practice sessions. This is way beyond my initial expectations. My tone is also way superior to what it was the first time around, and many have commented on my tone. However, let me be quick to point out I still have a long way to go, and what has worked for me will not necessarilty work for everyone.

Try this. Set your embochure on that top of the staff G. This will create a closed embochure. To do this, you will start by lightly putting your lips together and then sort of spit to start things off. I hope I am describing this sensation accurately. Do not change settings as you go lower or higher. With the top of the staff G set point, it is not hard to relax and play lower, and you don't have to tighten that much to play High C. When the embochure is properly set, it's mainly just air support and a "heee" sound when above the staff.

Good luck!!

Blaine

[jcmacman]

Welcome jbrobert.

Don't worry about range. Work on your tone, sight reading and fingering. I am now starting my 6 months of comeback playing and I hit my first Dbl C a few weeks ago. I never hit a Dbl C while I was playing over 15 years ago. I just felt real good one day I tried it. My daughter was in the room with me and was not impressed, Kids.....go figure. Once I hit it, it was like....cool now can I play Clarke Etudes all the way in one breath? For me that is alot harder.

I think you will find that your range will comeback to you alot faster and easier now, but the other aspects of your playing will take more time, effort, practice and patience.

I also found, here at TH, that you need to rest as much as you play. This will help you out alot.

Best of luck to you, keep us posted of your progress.

John

[INTJ]

While I disagree that not worrying about range and focusing on tone is the right way to go--never has been for me--I do agree that range is only one part of playing. I say that intonation and accuracy are more important than range.

Just make sure if you take the "don't worry about the range" approach and it does not work for you, that you will refocus your efforts. Few folks make significant improvement by sticking with a method that isn't working for them. The idea that you are not progressing because you aren't practicing 6 hours a day is a bad one. Yes, there comes a point when you have the basics of how you are going to play nailed down and the only way to improve is to just play more. However, don't feel you neeed to stick with any one method just becasue it worked for someone else. That approach is why I quit playing trumpet 26 years ago.

Interestingly, the fact that the previous poster's daughter wasn't impressed by his Double High C is very indicative of how most folks view trumpet high notes. The sound a trumpet has as it approaches Double C can be very exciting and musical, but much above that is only impressive to other trumpet players.

Blaine

[jcmacman]

Yea... my daughter plays piano and violin and is only 12.
My dog on the other hand starts howling when I play notes above High C.

John

[_Don Herman]

I set a goal of playing high C in three months. I succeeded. Five years later, I'm still living with the consequences of that. What it took to get there was not worth the bad habits I quickly learned. I'm working to make my real, solid, playable range high G or better. I can squeal over a triple C, but that's way above my working (or, performance) range. When I can come in cleanly on that high G at mf or softer (yeah, pp would be nice, but I don't really need that now) with good tone and control and tongue (not slur) nice little riffs around it, I'll be happy. Not satisfied, but happy. For at least a little while...

Now. Had I started with a teacher, and better resources (like TH folk), I'd have had that high C in about 3 to 6 months, with good control. I think. Everybody's different. My son picked up the horn and squealed out high Cs, and was able to do it consistently while growing the sound. (Alas, he switched to French horn.) Another student (not mine) is struggling with the G on top of the staff after a year.

So, maybe a high C in six months is a reasonable goal for you, maybe not. But, having a goal can be good, so pick one. Maybe G as a "working" range, with high C as a top note. Then forget about it! I think it's best to keep things positive (though I fail miserably myself, being a pessimistic pragmatist). Rather than setting "big" goals, decide to improve a little bit each day. Try to play a little softer, a little louder, Clarke a little faster, with a little better tone, a little higher... I think it's more important to practice everything, if not every day then on some reasonable schedule (e.g., range every other day, tonguing speed and scales the off days, but a little music every day), so you become a well balanced player. There will be areas you will excel at, and those that need more work. Work harder on the latter, but keep plugging away at the former so you bring everything up, together.

I'd imagine this is nothing new to you, or to anybody else, but I keep seeing kids who try for range over all and it troubles me. (Not saying you are one; this is a universal, nondiscriminatory rant for all ages.) A great player has to have it all, not just great tone, good range, great technique, etc. You can't get it all if you don't practice it all.

End of whiny little rant #386 - Don
_________________
Don Herman/Monument, CO
"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music." - Aldous Huxley

[_dcstep]

[INTJ]

I think the key is to work toward it all, becasue as has been said, a good player needs it all. The gripe I have is when a guy has range problems and the advice he gets is "don't worry about range". That is poor advice to such a player.

[Bob Cross]

I don't think it is a good idea to set a goal for range. Although it is important, you only have control over your efforts, and not the results. By trying to achieve a specific goal, you are setting yourself up for failure, or bad habits trying too hard to hit that goal. You can really mess up your chops trying to prove that you can hit that high note. Besides, your range is what you can reliably play with good endurance, flexibility, and musicality, and not what you can "hit" in practice.

What has worked for me:
1. Get a regular method, such as Caruso, Gordon, or BE. Of those, BE has worked best for in by far in the range department. Check out the BE forum here.

2. Get a teacher so you don't get into bad habits. A teacher or music store can help you find a place to play.

3. Find a place to play - a local brass band or community band or orchestra or church group or. . . That will give you incentive and expose you to your weaknesses. I made a big jump when I had the guts to join a band and an orchestra, although it was humiliating and intimidating at first.

Good luck
Bob

[_Don Herman]

On 2004-02-20 15:55, dcstep wrote:

That's wonderful, Don. So you had over 1,600 rants that weren't whiny at all?? That's a record to be proud of and something for the rest of us to strive to achieve.

Or... did I read that wrong. Instead you've got a catalog of whiny little rants and that's simply #386 out of a much longer list?

Either way, keep it up.

Dave

***

Ah, Dave... Hmmm... No, the rest were whiny BIG rants.

Bob, here's a thought (just a little one, I promise): Goals can be good. As Dave has reminded me, we all need something to strive for (tongue firmly in cheek...) Gives us motivation. Goals good, but maybe little goals are better. Better to set smaller, more achievable goals than something well beyond your reach. A little progress each day, each week, etc. 'Tis why I suggested pushing just a little, rather than a lot. A Caruso kinda' thing, perhaps. There's a great post on progress and thinking in terms of percentages rather than absolutes someplace in the CC forum (couldn't find it, but then I'm lazy, sorry!)

FWIWFM - Don (CP for the last five years, and likely to be the rest of my life)
_________________
Don Herman/Monument, CO
"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music." - Aldous Huxley

[INTJ]

Well, I would like to go on record with "Blaine's Gripe #1" and "#2."

1. Insisting there is one best way to approach trumpet playing and trying to make everyone use it

2. Telling a guy with range problems not to worry about range

Of course, both of those things were what made me put up the trumpet 26 years ago.

[LeeC]

All good advice, well what I read of it anyway. Didn't hear this one: Play in a local band or orchestra. It can be anything. A college rehearsal band, local civic synphony even a German band (ooom pah pah).

After you feel your chops get more consistent find another band and play out at least two nights a week.

Concentrate on two levels:

1. Keeping your aperture close)as ALP suggests) during home practice.

2. At rehearsals and concerts work on generating good volume within the perimeter of reasonable endurance. Push the envelope slightly each week.

[_swthiel]

Hi Blaine!

You make some good points!

[INTJ]

Steve,

No it wasn't you or really any specific poster on this thread. It's an attitude I often run into that exists way too much in the trumpet world. When I was a kid I was taken in by it. When I came back to trumpet I knew to watch out for it. i just want to make sure fellow comebacker's are sucked into such thinking..............

Blaine