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Vibrato.



 
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BardoXV
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2019 6:22 pm    Post subject: Vibrato. Reply with quote

How do you produce a vibrato on the trumpet?
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zaferis
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2019 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are a number of different approaches, they are not necessarily separate in function or use, and can/should vary from situation to situation.

tongue/throat - subtle movements in the oral cavity to produce the vibrato - like a vibrato in whistling

jaw - where the jaw is moved to creat the affect - still a subtle move (often working together with the tongue)

hand - rocking of the right hand on the instrument - changes the pressure on the embouchure creating the affect.

diaphragm - pulsing the air slightly using the diaphragm muscles - to me more of a tremolo than vibrato.

I use the tongue/throat and hand vibrato at times.. Use of the hand probuces a more "showy" affect - and can be a visable embelishment. (when a director asks you to add more vibrato, and you think you are already - moving your hand willl convince the director)

With practice all can/should be controlled and used intentionally and sparingly (like spices, wonderful in the right amount, awful if too much)

LIke other things, practice slowly and rhythmically, speeding up and slowing down, with varying intesity (narrow vs. wide). Learn to control it, not only on or off.
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GeorgeB
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2019 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me the hand works best for f and mf material and the jaw for p and pp.
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Richard III
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2019 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Playing early 1900's jazz with a Harry James style vibrato is kind of like farting in a crowded elevator. You could do it. But most people present aren't going to like it much. So whatever method you use, you have to be able to control it and use it in the style consistent with the music you are playing.
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sthomas98
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2019 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with using your hand to produce vibrato is that it involves repeatedly pushing the instrument back and forth on your lips— and generally you want to avoid pushing the instrument into your lips. In general, modern players do not use hand vibrato.

A better way to do vibrato is to first learn to do wide lip bends on notes (both to make the note sharp and flat), and then eventually learn to make these bends faster and less wide/pitch-altering. This becomes vibrato. It does not involve pushing the instrument into your lips like the hand method. It is also a good method because it gives you more control of your sound, so you can adjust your vibrato with respect to the style of music you are playing.

I've known a few people who actually can't control their vibrato— they always have some sort of fast throat/diaphragm-produced vibrato, and they can't play without vibrato. It reminds me of a flute vibrato. It is useful to be able to play notes straight, with no vibrato, as well.
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2019 5:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sthomas98 wrote:
The problem with using your hand to produce vibrato is that it involves repeatedly pushing the instrument back and forth on your lips— and generally you want to avoid pushing the instrument into your lips. In general, modern players do not use hand vibrato.
.....l.


Well....ok, I guess. You did say “generally” and “in general”, but I don’t really agree that using a hand vibrato is either outdated or in any way harmful. No, excessive mouthpiece pressure is absolutely not recommended, but watch any top player (Doc, Arturo, Maynard) in the extreme registers, there has to be enough pressure to create a seal between the mouthpiece and chops. I guess that’s obvious though.

Brad
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JoseLindE4
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2019 6:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray Sasaki has a good explanation here: https://cml.music.utexas.edu/online-resources/lips/ray-sasaki-trumpet/

As he points out, either of the two basic approaches work with good taste. With hand vibrato, it works better to push away than pull in.
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Billy B
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2019 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have never taught vibrato through mechanical means. I simply play and the student copies.
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trumpetchops
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PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's important to learn hand and another way. I use the jaw.

In general, the hand will work. It's not pushing or pulling but, a gentle rocking of the fingers on the valve buttons. This does change the pressure on the lips. It shouldn't be enough to notice any change with the embouchure.

I find doing it with the jaw gives me the sound I like better, still, I find times where the hand works so, you need both.
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gstump
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PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think of singing through the trumpet. For me the jaw is the subtle cause but the effect should be a singing sound.

Then there is the jazz vibrato. Spending on the phrase and tempo it can be so many things. Most common is adding a fast vibrato at the end of a sustained note.

Cheers,

Gordon Stump
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Robert P
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PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Be advised that a hand vibrato - more accurately a finger vibrato - involves a very subtle back and forth the R hand.

Go to about 1:00 and later points on this video which has closeups of Doc using a hand vibrato using the thumb and pinky and various fingers depending on what valves he was pushing. As far as I'm aware Doc pretty much exclusively used a hand vibrato.


Link

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starkadder
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PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How to practice vibrato:


Link


Fast forward to 4:08

Lather, rinse, repeat...
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trumpetchops wrote:
I think it's important to learn hand and another way. I use the jaw.

In general, the hand will work. It's not pushing or pulling but, a gentle rocking of the fingers on the valve buttons. This does change the pressure on the lips. It shouldn't be enough to notice any change with the embouchure.

I find doing it with the jaw gives me the sound I like better, still, I find times where the hand works so, you need both.


+1.

Brad
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BardoXV
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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My daughter was taking voice lessons and the teacher was very critical of singers who "wiggled their jaw" to produce a vibrato, she thought it should happen naturally if it happened at all.
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Billy B
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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BardoXV wrote:
My daughter was taking voice lessons and the teacher was very critical of singers who "wiggled their jaw" to produce a vibrato, she thought it should happen naturally if it happened at all.

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