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trumpet_cop Veteran Member
Joined: 18 Jun 2013 Posts: 242
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:01 am Post subject: Tweaking a horn |
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Who out in the world tweaks trumpets besides Wayne Tanabe? I've seen Wayne do it before and get out his little tool belt.. does anyone else do this?
Does anyone teach these techniques whether it be the whole thing like Wayne or even just little tweaks on the fly? Jim Becker maybe? _________________ Good Ol' Boy ID#3624360 |
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Don Herman rev2 'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 8951 Location: Monument, CO
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:03 am Post subject: |
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Many good techs can "tweak" a horn. Jim Becker, sure, and also Flip Oakes, Rich Ita, etc. We have a local guy that used to work with Wayne Mark Hammelev). _________________ "After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley |
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JVL Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Feb 2016 Posts: 894 Location: Nissa, France
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:00 am Post subject: |
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Bob Malone, Bobby Shew, Thomas Lubitz |
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bear30101 Regular Member
Joined: 05 Sep 2015 Posts: 89 Location: Ga.
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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George Rawlin _________________ searching |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8914 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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Depending on the tweaks, maybe Ken Larson.
https://www.brasswerks.com/ _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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Ozzbo Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Feb 2011 Posts: 137 Location: New York
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Josh Landress does it all !!!!
Ozzy Cardona |
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James Becker Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2005 Posts: 2827 Location: Littleton, MA
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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The practice of tweaking in my view should occur after all manner of deficiencies have been identified and corrected. This why blueprinting should be the first step in order to eliminate any doubt of unwanted perturbations in the bore. This is along the same lines Bob Reeves takes, recommending valve alignment before making mouthpiece modifications. It’s at that point you can assess whether you desire more or less resistance. The Bobby Shew tweak involves resizing the mouthpipe venturi. Wayne Tanabe’s tweaks similarly increase or decrease resistance along the critical junctions along the bore. How much or how little is determined by player feedback and careful listening to the player in order to identify which adjustments are appropriate for the individual. So you see, blueprinting can be performed independently without the player, while tweaking can only be done with player and technician working one on one. _________________ James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com
Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US
Last edited by James Becker on Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:20 am; edited 2 times in total |
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HERMOKIWI Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2008 Posts: 2581
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:37 pm Post subject: Re: Tweaking a horn |
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trumpet_cop wrote: | Who out in the world tweaks trumpets besides Wayne Tanabe? I've seen Wayne do it before and get out his little tool belt.. does anyone else do this?
Does anyone teach these techniques whether it be the whole thing like Wayne or even just little tweaks on the fly? Jim Becker maybe? |
Are you just gathering general information or are you looking for someone to tweak your horn? If you're looking for someone to tweak your horn specifically what are you wanting to tweak and why? _________________ HERMOKIWI |
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James Becker Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2005 Posts: 2827 Location: Littleton, MA
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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I would like to add, when Bobby Shew tweaks his personal model Yamaha Z trumpets for individuals, he plays the role of both play tester and tweaker. _________________ James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com
Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US |
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JVL Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Feb 2016 Posts: 894 Location: Nissa, France
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Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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James Becker wrote: | I would like to add, when Bobby Shew tweaks his personal model Yamaha Z trumpets for individuals, he plays the role of both play tester and tweaker. |
and then, there's a great "before and after" ! |
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James Becker Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2005 Posts: 2827 Location: Littleton, MA
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Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:01 am Post subject: |
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What we’re dealing with when tweaking to personal taste is on a micro level. That’s to say, how many ten thousandths of an inch sets up your trumpet to feel just right? According to Doc Severinsen his preferred venturi measurement is not .344”, not .345”, but is .3445”. And upon measuring a Shires Severinsen trumpet that was in our shop for service, my micrometer read .3445”! The truth is there’s only a few manufacturers that maintain that level of consistency. Some might think plus or minus one thousandth is in the ballpark. We’ve witnessed Bach 25H pipes that are supposed to be .351” measure as large as .354” and as small as .349”, and it isn’t hard to feel and hear the difference that makes. The funny thing is, like mouthpiece throats, not everyone cares for the same opening. Suffice to say, in some instances larger is not always better. Positive resistance can be set up anywhere, the question is what is appropriate for you.
I hope this is helpful. _________________ James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com
Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US |
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James Becker Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2005 Posts: 2827 Location: Littleton, MA
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Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:33 am Post subject: |
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Allow me to express the difference between blueprinting and tweaking in musical terms.
Blueprinting addresses execution of a design, think musical score. Making sure all the notes are played correctly in tune and in time with proper dynamics and articulations.
Tweaking is more like musical interpretation dictated by the conductor. One’s preferences are determined by feel and sound.
How an instrument is set up is the function of both it’s design and connection with player. One is not subjective while the other is entirely subjective. _________________ James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com
Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US |
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James Becker Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2005 Posts: 2827 Location: Littleton, MA
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Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:36 am Post subject: |
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As a follow up to the Martin Committee thread where I previously posted, I'd like to share this update.
Wallace Roney's Kanstul made Martin Committee tweak is completed. I'd been asked by Wallace to choke the bell in the manner of a Claude Gordon, not possible without removing the bell then remounting. As many might already be aware the Benge C.G valve bore is .468" with a choke of -.004" at the bell down to .464", while the Selmer USA C.G. is .470" with a choke down to .466". Since Kanstul's XL bore is .470" the bell would need to be reduced to .466". With the bell opening already at .472" this took a bit of doing, but was a success. This transformed an otherwise wide open blowing trumpet to have a bit more positive resistance to blow against than before.
Having a working knowledge of what is desired by the player, we're able to target specific points along the bore to provide greater efficiency for the player. But unlike the Bobby Shew tweak which alters the venturi at the beginning of the trumpet bore, this tweak is much further along the bore.
I hope this is helpful. _________________ James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com
Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US |
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tylerjaeger55 New Member
Joined: 04 Oct 2016 Posts: 5 Location: Yorktown Va
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Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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I think that rich Ita in Atlanta is great and Trent Austin in Kansas City |
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