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WildWilly
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Location: Iowa next to the Mississippi
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 Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:00 am Post subject: Newbie Questions |
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Full Disclosure - I have a BIG mouth with big lips and "think" my Cannonball 5B mouthpiece is too small, diameter and depth. Are the numbers used for mouthpieces an industry standard or do they vary by manufacturer? Would a Bach 1 be a noticeable difference from a 5B? I apologize if these questions have been asked hundreds of time. I did wade through the topics in this thread but couldn't find answers to my questions. Thank you for any and all input.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:17 am Post subject: |
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In this context, is "Newbie" a beginner or just new to this forum? What is your playing background?
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coraltrpt
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Joined: 18 Oct 2016
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:57 am Post subject: |
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In some ways - the “standard” Bach mouthpiece numbers can line-up with other makers. It’s always good to check the specs to make sure. Definitely a Pandora’s box of info, this topic. Schilke and Yamaha have their own systems. It gets complicated.
I’m not familiar with Cannonball, but a Bach 5B would certainly feel much different compared to a straight Bach 1. I’m betting the Cannonball 5B is similar to a Bach 5B. Just a hunch.
Sidenote: I believe the Bob Sullivan Yamaha model is a 5B cup with the Herseth 1X rim and a 23 throat. You might find that interesting for your situation. I don’t know... |
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WildWilly
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:38 am Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | | In this context, is "Newbie" a beginner or just new to this forum? What is your playing background? |
Returning to the trumpet after a 65 year layoff. So, green as a gourd.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:52 am Post subject: |
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[quote="WildWilly"] | kehaulani wrote: | | So, green as a gourd. |
Some gourds are grey, old and worn. 
If I were you, I wouldn't make a great change. Standard mouthpieces from Bach, Schilke and Yamaha are not expensive. I wouldn't advise going on a full-blown mouthpiece safari, that could get costly, but a moderate change. And give it some time, don't expect overnight results.
In my experience, Yamaha and Schilke inner rims are a little bit more comfortable. I would probably give a Yamaha 14B4 or a Schllke 15B, rough equavelents to a Bach 3, a try.
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wilder
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Location: NYC
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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| spent the last half hour looking for the specs on CANNONBALL mouthpieces and I could not find anything including on the manufacturers website. apparently discontinued. there is no industry standard for sizing nomenclature. all you can do really, is start from scratch. try a BACH 3C and go from there if you don't like it. good luck! jw |
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RussellDDixon
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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None of the mouthpiece manufacturer's measure their pieces exactly alike; thus, there really aren't any apples to apples comparisons with mouthpiece measurements. I have built this mouthpiece chart just to show what is out there in a certain measurement "ball park" so to speak. The size of your lips doesn't matter; it's what your are physically comfortable playing while producing a solid tone and sound.
http://www.trumpetperformancetips.com/trumpet-mouthpiece-comparison-chart.html |
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hibidogrulez
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | | If I were you, I wouldn't make a great change. Standard mouthpieces from Bach, Schilke and Yamaha are not expensive. I wouldn't advise going on a full-blown mouthpiece safari, that could get costly, but a moderate change. And give it some time, don't expect overnight results. |
Second that. It's virtually impossible to tell what mouthpiece works for you, especially if you're just (re)starting out.
Unless the mouthpiece you have now really doesn't work for you, you could use it for now. Other than that, go somewhere that lets you try lots of different mouthpieces, so you can at least get a feel of what you like.
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If it were the person playing rather than the gear they use, I would sound even worse.
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GeorgeB
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:18 am Post subject: |
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If the Cannonball 5B was your main mp 65 years ago I'd bet my boots it won't work for you today. I made a comeback after a 50 year hiatus and thought my old Bach 10.5C would still work for me. It didn't. A lot changed in 50 years, including a full set of upper dentures. I tried a lot of different size mps and eventually found the 65MD Wedge was the right one, a much larger piece than the 10.5C. But my case may be different than yours, so give the 5B a chance. If it eventually works, you will save yourself an expensive mouthpiece safari.
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GeorgeB
Manchester Brass Custom ( ACB ) RL-GB pro B flat trumpet
1942 Buescher 400 225 (ML Bore ) Bb trumpet
1952 Selmer Paris 21 B flat trumpet
1959 Selmer Paris 24B
1999 Conn Vintage One B flat trumpet
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hibidogrulez
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:53 am Post subject: |
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| GeorgeB wrote: | | If the Cannonball 5B was your main mp 65 years ago I'd bet my boots it won't work for you today. |
That'd be interesting to say the least given that the company was founded in 1996.
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If it were the person playing rather than the gear they use, I would sound even worse.
Tpts: Olds Recording & Getzen 700 SP
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Jerry
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:37 am Post subject: |
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Why don't you ask these guys how your 5B would approximately fall in to the Bach numbering system?
Contact Information
Cannonball Musical Instruments
625 E Sego Lily Dr.
Sandy, Utah 84070
United States of America
001-801-563-3081
info@cannonballmusic.com |
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GeorgeB
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Location: New Glasgow, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| hibidogrulez wrote: | | GeorgeB wrote: | | If the Cannonball 5B was your main mp 65 years ago I'd bet my boots it won't work for you today. |
That'd be interesting to say the least given that the company was founded in 1996. |
Yeah, that would be interesting... 
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GeorgeB
Manchester Brass Custom ( ACB ) RL-GB pro B flat trumpet
1942 Buescher 400 225 (ML Bore ) Bb trumpet
1952 Selmer Paris 21 B flat trumpet
1959 Selmer Paris 24B
1999 Conn Vintage One B flat trumpet
Getzen 490 Bb
1962 Conn Victor 5A cornet |
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WildWilly
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Joined: 05 Jul 2020
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Location: Iowa next to the Mississippi
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 6:22 am Post subject: |
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THANK YOU one and all for the responses. A wealth of info in this forum and I'm thankful I discovered it at the start of my re-entry.
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WildWilly
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:25 am Post subject: |
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I ordered and recieved a Bach 1 mouthpiece. While it feels more comfortable it doesn't affect my tone or playing in any way. I figure I got a lesson and a spare mouthpiece in the same package.
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JayKosta
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:20 am Post subject: |
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| WildWilly wrote: | | I ordered and recieved a Bach 1 mouthpiece. While it feels more comfortable it doesn't affect my tone or playing in any way. I figure I got a lesson and a spare mouthpiece in the same package. |
-------------------------------
A possibly related view here -
https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1603549#1603549
Jay
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WildWilly
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Posts: 62
Location: Iowa next to the Mississippi
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:12 am Post subject: |
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| JayKosta wrote: | | WildWilly wrote: | | I ordered and recieved a Bach 1 mouthpiece. While it feels more comfortable it doesn't affect my tone or playing in any way. I figure I got a lesson and a spare mouthpiece in the same package. |
-------------------------------
A possibly related view here -
https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1603549#1603549
Jay |
Spot on Jay and thanks for sharing. I'm taking lessons via FaceTime and my teacher has been a tremendous help with lip placement. Had me try different postitions and angles. Finding what best works for me.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 10:09 am Post subject: |
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| WildWilly wrote: | | I ordered and recieved a Bach 1 mouthpiece. |
Congratulations, hope it works out. And if you get restless, I understand there's an adapter for trumpet that lets you use a trombone mouthpiece.
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"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Charlie Parker
"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis."
Chet Baker |
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PMonteiro
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Posts: 78
Location: Hudson Valley
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| Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:00 pm Post subject: Re: Newbie Questions |
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| WildWilly wrote: | | Are the numbers used for mouthpieces an industry standard or do they vary by manufacturer? |
The Bach-style numbers (e.g. "5B") are a rough industry standard, but not an exact measurement among manufacturers. Not even Bach itself adheres precisely to these standards (due to their notorious inconsistency which has gotten better with CNC machining).
Some examples:
Of the 3Cs I own, the Blessing feels like an almost exact Bach-specification mouthpiece. My cheap unmarked 3C is close, but the rim feels a bit different. Then there's the 3CW, whose rim doesn't resemble a 3 at all, and actually has a bigger inner diameter than my 1 1/2C.
One of my Bach 5Cs is a tad bigger and more rounded than the other. It feels closer to a 1 1/2B.
None of the 7Cs I've had felt alike. Again, the Blessing is closest to the Bach. One of my unbranded ones was close, but not quite, while the other was huge, closer to a 5 or 3 diameter.
| WildWilly wrote: | | Would a Bach 1 be a noticeable difference from a 5B? |
Yes, there will be a noticeable difference between a 1 and a 5, but that difference is easily manageable. I play a 5C on Bb and a 1 1/2B on C, and I can switch between them instantaneously without problems. I too have fairly fleshy lips, My comfortable rim range is from 1 1/2 to 5. I tend to have difficulty with anything larger or smaller.
I think that rim shape is more important than exact rim diameter.
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