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Advice sought in regards to a trade


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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:13 pm    Post subject: Advice sought in regards to a trade Reply with quote

I play lead in my area in a few groups and I'm always looking for new horns to try (yeah I know practice, I already do that)

The horns I have currently are a Mount Vernon Strad raw brass with a Blackburn 20 leadpipe and an Old's Mendez.

I've been interested in trying the Bergeron model Yamaha and I found a guy who's interested in trading for my Strad. Would you advice against this trade, for this trade, either or?

I'm very new to horns in general outside of my practice as a music major in college. Any advice would be very appreciated!
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Christian K. Peters
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:25 pm    Post subject: Advice sought Reply with quote

Hello,
I would not trade the Strad. Sounds like you have it dialed in. Save your shackles and buy what ever horn you have a fancy for. Use that horn to keep or trade. Once I had the cash to buy, I would then keep which ever was a better fit. Once you get rid of the Mt Vernon, you might be remorseful.
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jondrowjf@gmail.com
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:28 pm    Post subject: Bergeron Reply with quote

Have you researched this trumpet on line? Looked at the specs, reviews, watched videos?How does the strad differ from the Bergeron horn? Before you trade talk to your instructors about the two horns. Could your instructors listen to you play both horns? Why are you considering a trade? What is the benefit for you?
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Bergeron Reply with quote

jondrowjf@gmail.com wrote:
Have you researched this trumpet on line? Looked at the specs, reviews, watched videos?How does the strad differ from the Bergeron horn? Before you trade talk to your instructors about the two horns. Could your instructors listen to you play both horns? Why are you considering a trade? What is the benefit for you?


If I had an instructor to ask, I would. I've since graduated from college and am playing in my area. And my professor would tell me to practice. I've differed from my professor's view on equipment.

The reason I'm looking for a different horn is because I'm trying to find a setup that facilitates an easier upper register. The Bach fights me a bit when I get above C.
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hibidogrulez
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apart from the usual things like monetary value, compare-testing the horns, checking specs and reviews and such you should also ask yourself why you want to get rid of your current trumpet. Is it really that bad that you no longer want to keep it?
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OldSchoolEuph
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The word in your post that bothers me is "try". I wouldn't part with a known quantity in exchange for an unknown.

That being said, your logic seems sound. Your Bach as altered has effectively become a more open blowing strad 180 with a (by modern understanding) lightweight bell. A classic warm full Bach sound with better response from the bell weight than a standard and a little ability to light up, but still strong core. An 8335LA by comparison would have similar responsiveness and (maybe more) stability at higher dynamics, but would trade some of that warm Bach core for a bit more brilliance and the ability to really cut when pushed.

These are generalities of course. How the player interacts with the equipment is 50% of the equation - which is why I wouldn't lose the Bach until sure (from the experience of playing it for a couple weeks) that the Yamaha was going to work for me.
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No I do like my Bach but I don't play a lot of classical music any more. I started my own NOLA style Brass Band and play lead in big band. While I practice a nice warm tone, I perform with more of a bright and cutting tone that the music demands. However, I agree with all the sentiments said thus far. I feel like Bilbo in that I don't want to be parted with it.

I don't think I'm plagued with the Excalibur Horn quest but I am looking for a horn that will best suit my needs. I recently started working at BAC Horn Factory and have been a play tested there and have learned that while older horns were manufactured well, there are aspects of horns I haven't thought of like the balance of playing and how the mouthpiece affects says balance.

I suppose I should look for a different mouthpiece first but I like Wayne's sound and have been interested in trying it. We don't have a Yamaha dealer that I'm aware of that's close enough to test horns.
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Aspeyrer
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In general, the yamaha Bergeron trumpets sell for quite a bit less than a Mt Vernon, even altered. Just one recent example;

https://www.ebay.com/itm/283948052907
$1450 or best offer in good condition.

I’ve almost always had bad luck with trades, but just my personal experience. Likely, they are willing to trade an axe they don’t want to/cannot use anymore, but not always the case.

As others have suggested, see if you can try a Bergeron or 2 before making the final trade. I’ve traded on TH with the caveat that if we both didn’t feel comfortable, we would trade back, even if one of us liked the trade. That one worked out. Good luck!
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cgaiii
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you in Japan Yoshinori?
I am not sure of what the situation is with COVID-19 and the many used music stores there, but if you are in Japan, you have a golden opportunity to try many horns. Go to any of the centers of brass shops, like the one in Ochanomizu and cruise the shops trying used horns. You can find what you like through experimentation instead of guessing. That is how I got my favorite horn.
Then you can talk trade.
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um no I'm not. I made this account in my more cringy youth as an avid lover of anime. And I just haven't bothered changing the username as I believe it is translated to mean the same as my actual name. I live in the KC metro area
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cgaiii
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh well. Sorry for the useless advice and the assumption.
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cgaiii wrote:
Oh well. Sorry for the useless advice and the assumption.


No it was great advice. I'm finding that more of my adult life is dedicated to facepalming at my younger self. No harm done. I still would love to find a place to test Yamaha in my area. I'll do a dealer search. Last I checked the closest wad in Nebraska.
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OldSchoolEuph
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yoshinori76 wrote:
No I do like my Bach but I don't play a lot of classical music any more. I started my own NOLA style Brass Band and play lead in big band. While I practice a nice warm tone, I perform with more of a bright and cutting tone that the music demands. However, I agree with all the sentiments said thus far. I feel like Bilbo in that I don't want to be parted with it.

I don't think I'm plagued with the Excalibur Horn quest but I am looking for a horn that will best suit my needs. I recently started working at BAC Horn Factory and have been a play tested there and have learned that while older horns were manufactured well, there are aspects of horns I haven't thought of like the balance of playing and how the mouthpiece affects says balance.

I suppose I should look for a different mouthpiece first but I like Wayne's sound and have been interested in trying it. We don't have a Yamaha dealer that I'm aware of that's close enough to test horns.


That you are at BAC yet looking at an 8335LA is a bit unexpected.

I will assume that the Z72 is perhaps a bit broad and dark relative to what you have in mind (?), but what about the new Benge - specifically with the modern pipe, not the optimized Besson "Chicago" version? I was told this month was the release target for those.
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2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
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1957 Holton Model 27 Stratodyne
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson British Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OldSchoolEuph wrote:


That you are at BAC yet looking at an 8335LA is a bit unexpected.

I will assume that the Z72 is perhaps a bit broad and dark relative to what you have in mind (?), but what about the new Benge - specifically with the modern pipe, not the optimized Besson "Chicago" version? I was told this month was the release target for those.


I've only recently started there and don't have the cash flow to purchase something new. That's why the trade seemed appealing. I don't really need two horns. I'll definitely ask around and see what options are available
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Jerry
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yoshinori76 wrote:
...I live in the KC metro area

Isn't Trent Austin in KC? I bet he has significant inventory in used horns and could lead you to a horn that could work for you.
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ProAm
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A friend of mine who usually plays a Bach 43 really liked the 8335LA that he tried when they first came out a few years ago.

Is this a trade where you both can sit down and try out each other's horn? Can you meet up and make the trade conditional on each agreeing to it after an hour trial, for example?

An altered Mt Vernon and a pristine 8335LA could be in the same ebay-value ballpark. If you each find that you prefer the other's horn, sounds like it could work for both of you. I wouldn't get hung up too much on maybe not getting maximal value out of your Mt Vernon.

If you can, try before you trade. If you can't, read what you can about the LA and maybe give it a try. Youth is the time for making mistakes .... but it is ultimately up to you to decide how much risk you can tolerate.
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Yoshinori76
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need to address something that has come back to me. A: I work for BAC Music Store as a repair tech. B: This post was specifically about whether or not the trade was advisable, not about make and manufacture
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wilder
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi. Don't trade. jw
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theslawdawg
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Advice sought in regards to a trade Reply with quote

Yoshinori76 wrote:
I play lead in my area in a few groups and I'm always looking for new horns to try (yeah I know practice, I already do that)

The horns I have currently are a Mount Vernon Strad raw brass with a Blackburn 20 leadpipe and an Old's Mendez.

I've been interested in trying the Bergeron model Yamaha and I found a guy who's interested in trading for my Strad. Would you advice against this trade, for this trade, either or?

I'm very new to horns in general outside of my practice as a music major in college. Any advice would be very appreciated!


Trade?

No.
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Pete
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had an 8335LA a few years ago. I thought that it played really big. Keep the Bach.

Pete
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