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haas Regular Member
Joined: 10 Jun 2020 Posts: 25 Location: EUROPE
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 1:47 pm Post subject: Fake or Real ? Bach MT VERNON |
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Hi, I bought a bach mt Vernon 7c. I play it great i wonder if it is original or fake ? What modern mouthpiece can it be compared to ? Greetings from Europe
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oxleyk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 4180
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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The engraving that makes me think it wasn't stamped. Are those mill marks in the engraving?
I had a Mt. Vernon 7C once. I bought it for $25 and sold it for $40. The only mouthpiece I ever made money on. |
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benlewis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 21 Jan 2004 Posts: 1011 Location: Memphis, TN
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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All my Mt. Vernons read:
VINCENT BACH CORP MT VERNON NY "size"
All capital letters, no punctuations...
I'd guess it's a copy. That being said, if it plays well for you and you didn't pay a premium for the provenance, good on ya!
HTH
Ben |
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StartingUpAgainAt53 Regular Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2018 Posts: 44 Location: Half Moon Bay, CA
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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I have several Mt Vernon mouthpieces I inherited- 8 are marked as benlewis says. Three have punctuation for MT. CORP. and N.Y. (edited to MT. from M.T.)
Agree, if it works for you then that is all that matters unless your trying to sell it.
Cheers,
Marc
Last edited by StartingUpAgainAt53 on Sun May 09, 2021 4:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8335 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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JeffM729 Veteran Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2004 Posts: 442 Location: Parrish, FL
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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I've never seen a Bach MT VERNON mouthpiece without the NY afterward. |
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huntman10 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Aug 2017 Posts: 692 Location: Texas South Plains
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Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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I saw something like that on eBay, looks like it was computer engraved, not stamped. I vote for a copy, but if it plays well, you got a mouthpiece that works for you. _________________ huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc. |
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Irving Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Feb 2003 Posts: 1887
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 12:02 am Post subject: |
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Bach Mt. Vernon 7Cs aren't worth much money so I wonder who would go to the trouble of trying to make a fake copy? Check the throat opening. Modern post Mt. Vernon Bach mouthpieces are made with a 27 throat (3.65). Many Mt. Vernons were made with a 28 throat (3.56mm), so if it has a 28 throat you know it is a real Mt. Vernon. |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8335 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 12:12 am Post subject: |
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Irving wrote: | Bach Mt. Vernon 7Cs aren't worth much money so I wonder who would go to the trouble of trying to make a fake copy? Check the throat opening. Modern post Mt. Vernon Bach mouthpieces are made with a 27 throat (3.65). Many Mt. Vernons were made with a 28 throat (3.56mm), so if it has a 28 throat you know it is a real Mt. Vernon. |
I've seen Asian copies of things that aren't worth much before.
There are Asian copies of Bach Strad trumpets. There are also Asian copies of Yamaha student trumpets. You would think they wouldn't bother with the latter, but they do. _________________ LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn |
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Mike Prestage Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Oct 2012 Posts: 722 Location: Hereford, UK
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 1:20 am Post subject: |
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The sharp edges to the ornamentation on the shank are another pointer to this being a copy.
I doubt the people making decisions about what to fake have much knowledge or insight into the finer points of the trumpet mouthpiece market. The Bach 7C is a 'best-selling' mouthpiece and there's loads of hype/mystique about the products of the Mt. Vernon factory. If you know those two things...
Mike |
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loweredsixth Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Feb 2005 Posts: 1844 Location: Fresno, California, USA, North America, Earth, Solar System, Orion Arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Universe
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 5:07 am Post subject: |
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There was a post some time ago about these mouthpieces. They are reproductions. As mentioned before, there’s no “NY” on that mouthpiece. _________________ The name I go by in the real world is Joe Lewis |
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loweredsixth Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Feb 2005 Posts: 1844 Location: Fresno, California, USA, North America, Earth, Solar System, Orion Arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Universe
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Irving Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Feb 2003 Posts: 1887
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 5:13 am Post subject: |
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There is a Rome, New York so maybe there is a Mt.Vernon , China? |
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Aspeyrer Veteran Member
Joined: 18 Nov 2019 Posts: 106
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 9:56 am Post subject: |
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This is NOT a “Bach” brand mouthpiece.
But, it’s also not a copy. They didn’t scan the inners or outers of a Bach Mt Vernon mouthpiece to create this.
The size is probably close to a stock 7C but depends on the wear of the cutter at the time yours was made.
On a side note; I think it’s kind of cool and I’m a little jealous. It’s unlikely these supposedly new pre 1965 “Mt. Vernon Bachs” with modern packaging would even put a knick in current conn-selmer sales. If you like the mouthpiece and didn’t pay too much, good on you. |
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