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That musty old case aroma



 
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trpthrld
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 12:47 pm    Post subject: That musty old case aroma Reply with quote

I know there have been threads on this before, with at least one of those being mine.

I read recently about using an Ozone Generator to clear out the mold & bacteria that create that odor. The guy had run a plastic hose from the generator into a case then shut but did not latch the case.

An Ozone generator runs around $50, a very reasonable investment if it produces results.

So my questions are (and please feel free to answer)

- Any pros and cons on using this machine & method?
- If you've done this, were the results long-lasting or was this now a regular practice like cleaning a trumpet (every 6 months or so)?
- Any suggestions for better results or anything safety-wise?

I have a couple of vintage Schilke cases that I really like but the aroma is to a point where I'd rather not keep my horns in those cases.

Thanks in advance for any comments!
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rsfracer
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd be cautious of an ozone generator - There is a huge Phillips CPAP recall right now because of the ozone cleaners being sold to clean CPAP machines is causing some of the sound deadening foam to deteriorate. An un-intended consequence. I do believe it would eliminate the odor - just not sure what it would do to the padding and other material in the case.
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was a lengthy discussion on SOTW and the consensus was that if the case was too long gone, there's nothing much you can do about it. Better to just buy a new case.
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Uberopa
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried to salvage a mouldy old case. I had the case put through an ozone generator that removes smoke odours after fires. No luck. Tried the mould and spore killer sprays with no luck. Its just not worth the money and effort involved
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Bryant Jordan
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I purchased a cornet off ebay for $50 that came with a cool Martin Handcraft case. The case reeked of smoke, and there was no way to salvage it. It got smashed in during transit though, so I would have thrown it out anyways (don't worry, the horn was fine miraculously).
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Crazy Finn
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SOTW?
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trpthrld
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is the reply I received from the guy who had posted about using an Ozone generator.

==============================

My setup, while very effective for the kind of application we're talking about, it's not really intended for it. It's a medical-grade system consisting of a dual-stage ozone generator fed by an Invacare oxygen concentrator. The whole setup costs around $2,000.00.

It was not designed for the purposes of de-funkifying things, but it works great for that. There are other kinds of machines, such as the one linked below that are intended for getting rid of smells in cars and rooms in the house that are very inexpensive, comparatively speaking.

The problem with one of those inexpensive machines, though, is that there's no place to hook it to a tube or hose that feeds into the case. Also, the inexpensive machine is fed by ambient air, which doesn't provide the purity or strength of ozone that my setup produces with the oxygen concentrator.

Anyway, with the inexpensive machine you'd have to put the open case in a small remote closet in the house with the ozone generator, seal it off by putting a towel under the door, then run it for a while. You'd probably get good results by running it in a small enclosed space like a remote closet or a car for a couple of hours and then let it sit undisturbed for another 6 hours. Or maybe treating your car with the open case in there might work.

The main thing is to avoid breathing in the ozone because it will destroy your lungs. When houses are treated with ozone for mold, the house must be vacated while the treatment is in progress and no one can return until the house is aired out.

As far as your 2nd question is concerned, it is a permanent solution IF, and that's a big IF, the ozone is able to penetrate through the entire affected area and kill all of the odor-causing mold and bacteria.

So for example, if the shell of the case is made of porous material and there is mold and bacteria embedded in the shell, (not just the velvet lining) and the ozone is not applied long enough, or in enough of a concentration to get the stuff that's in the shell of the case, the bacteria or mold will eventually spread back into the case lining and cause it to smell again. So yes, the ozone kills the problem permanently if it reaches all of the porous materials in the case.

The reason that the people you called didn't make any guarantees is because they can't guarantee that they'll be able to achieve the penetration required in order to get lasting results. They're used to treating homes and cars, so they know what kinds of results they can get there, but instrument cases are tricky.

I was successful with my machine on my old King Silver Flair case and a friend's Conn Constellation case, but that's because my pure oxygen-fed system, coupled with a small hose that can feed right into the closed case, I'm able to get a real strong concentration of ozone in there.

https://www.amazon.com/Enerze.../dp/B00JAP7388/ref=sr_1_3...
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy Finn wrote:
SOTW?

Sorry. Sax on the Web. Easily the pre-eminent web sax forum, if not nationally, internationally. Good source.
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Riojazz
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy Finn, SOTW is Sax on the Web. It's a sax group similar in purpose to this site.
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some people are big DIY folks and don't mind the aggravation and cost at all. More power to them. Me? I'd rather punch in wwbw.com from the comfort of my computer seat and be done with it.

I understand the nostalgia thing, though. I had a Commitee case that was, cosmetically, pristine and that I paid $300.00 for. When I got it, no matter what I did it as unusable because of the smell. Big disappointment, not to mention the time and money lost. Had to buy a new case anyway so, in essence, the case cost me almost double.
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"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Charlie Parker
"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis."
Chet Baker

Bach Bicentennial Strad 190-37
Adams F-1 Flugelhorn
Conn 80-A Cornet
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dstpt
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sprayaway works pretty well...mentioned in this thread...

https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=155868&sid=4bd3749529cf46525ab70efdead5b60b

The ozone machine reminds me of how my ionizers worked inside my older cases, which were fairly effective. I have a sensitive sniffer, though, so I can't say that any of these things worked 100%.

ionizer vs. ozone
https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=ionizer+vs+ozone&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
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Andy Cooper
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just so you know - we are not alone.

Collectors of antique Singer Sewing machines have the same problem.
Search for:

"singer sewing machine case deodorizer"

You will find a variety of products and processes. You will also find info on case restoration.

Personally, I would avoid the one that suggests massive exposure to gamma and vita rays...
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Crazy Finn
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kehaulani wrote:
Crazy Finn wrote:
SOTW?

Sorry. Sax on the Web. Easily the pre-eminent web sax forum, if not nationally, internationally. Good source.


Riojazz wrote:
Crazy Finn, SOTW is Sax on the Web. It's a sax group similar in purpose to this site.

Ah, thanks. I'm familiar with the site, poked around there a bit, but acronyms...
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