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brother
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Joined: 27 Nov 2002
Posts: 60
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 Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | I'm a little confused by your description of your wants. The examples you provide (and it's refreshing that someone is so detailed in their wants, so thank you) sound very much like flugelhorns to me. I was expecting, from your prior writing, an almost trumpet sound. But I hear flugelhorn, not trumpet.
So, I'll just say this. I have an Adams F-1, which I think will give you what you're looking for. A lot of the sound comes from your sound/mental concept and mouthpiece.
If you want trumpety, and save yourself money at the same time, there are some trumpet mouthpieces made by reputable makers that are to be played on trumpet but is intended to give you a flugelhorn vibe. I think Reeves has one and I think, at least, another maker has one too, but can't think f the name.
I've got one, but I've now got a flugelhorn, too, so don't need it. If you're curious, I'll sell it to you at a lark so you can try it. Just send me a PM. (And I didn't write the preceding to promote this. It is an afterthought.) |
They weren't my examples but I agree they do sound like flugelhorns :) Always hard to put this stuff into words and in the end, a lot of an instrument is in how it feels to play.
As for those flugel-for-trumpet mouthpieces, I have the Reeves c2j and it's fine to make a facsimile of a flugel sound on trumpet in a pinch but that's all, imho. On the other hand, an actual flugel mouthpiece with the appropriate adapter in my Wild Thing trumpet is not too bad. Still prefer flugel though. |
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brother
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Joined: 27 Nov 2002
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: flugels |
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| terrys17 wrote: | My current flugel is the stomvi 4 valve version of the titan. Best playing flugel I've owned and I've owned many different brands. I had a callet jazz some years ago. Very open blow throughout and a great horn from the back row. The stomvi has similar qualities and a sweeter sound, imo. Great presence in the big band and it sounds amazing in church. Stomvi valves are amazing as well.
Truly worth checking out |
Yes, I am playing the Stomvi Titan now! (3 valve, copper bell) It's a great horn in the practice room: intonation is really good, actual usable high range (shock/horror) and a beautiful sound ... BUT, I seem to get swamped on the band stand outside of ballads. It could also be a player feedback thing, I suppose. It really is a great horn but perhaps just not quite right for me ... atm. Some more practise and ability wouldn't go astray as always! |
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terrys17
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Joined: 23 Aug 2002
Posts: 383
Location: St Augustine, FL
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| Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Never played the 3 valve titan but I had the elite flugel with a copper bell. The copper bell doesn't have the same presence as the bellflex imo. The 4 valve bellflex is a completely different animal. No problem being heard within the band. I prefer the sound of this one over the elite. (or the jazz) |
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RETrumpet
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Joined: 26 Jan 2021
Posts: 210
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| Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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Have you looked into the new Scodwell? He designed it with a lot of the challenges you mentioned in mind and tuning from the branch rather than the leadpipe solves a good deal of the typical intonation issues.
.433 bore, so you can get some air into when you need it, but it doesn't feel huge. And it's fairly mouthpiece sensitive if you want to go that route to change up your color palette.
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Bb: FrankenBach, '72 Committee, Conn 22B, King 2070SGX
C: Bach 229-MK slide/pipe, Bach 226 with YTR-9445(2) pipe
D/Eb: Bach 239 with YTR-9636 pipe
Picc: Stomvi Master, Couesnon Monopole
Cornet: Schilke A2C, '23 Buescher
Flugel: Scodwell Prototype |
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Halflip
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 1925
Location: WI
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| Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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The more I think about it, the more I think you should check out the YFH-8315G. According to Yamaha, Wayne Bergeron was a "co-designer" of this horn, and I seem to recall reading that it had its roots in the 635T. It definitely has some different characteristics (in sound and playing 'feel') from the Shew 8310Z.
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"He that plays the King shall be welcome . . . " (Hamlet Act II, Scene 2, Line 1416)
"He had no concept of the instrument. He was blowing into it." -- Virgil Starkwell's cello teacher in "Take the Money and Run" |
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Brassnose
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Joined: 07 Mar 2016
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Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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@brother: if you really get swamped by the band, then maybe flugel is not the way to go?
A few options:
- flugel with a shallow mouthpiece
- flugel with a smaller bell
- cornet
- microphone
- reduce the overall power of the band (yeah, I know  )
But before you do anything, you should record the band with you on flugel. Maybe the stage is just too loud and you can’t hear yourself but the audience hears you fine? In that case, playing with ear protection (amplifies your own voice in your head - takes time to get used to, but I wouldn’t miss it anymore) or proper in ear monitoring may be a way to go.
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2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
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1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
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Subtropical and Subpar
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Joined: 22 May 2020
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Location: Here and there
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 6:51 am Post subject: |
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To second an earlier post in this thread, I also use a Curry FL-M mouthpiece and it does send my horn, a Manchester Brass aka Yammie 631 clone, right over to "Chuck Mangione playing Feels So Good" timbre-land.
The more recent suggestion of cornet + British Brass style mouthpiece has some merit, too, although such a combo can be very dark in timbre.
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1932 King Silvertone cornet
1936 King Liberty No. 2 trumpet
1958 Reynolds Contempora 44-M "Renascence" C
1962 Reynolds Argenta LB trumpet
1965 Conn 38A
1995 Bach LR18072
2003 Kanstul 991
2011 Schilke P5-4 B/G
2021 Manchester Brass flugel |
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Halflip
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brother
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Joined: 27 Nov 2002
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| I think I'm going to take a chance on an Adams F1 with a sterling bell but I'll keep in mind the suggestions for when the search continues. Except for the one about cornet :) |
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stuartissimo
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Joined: 17 Dec 2021
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Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Brassnose wrote: | | @brother: if you really get swamped by the band |
That comment got me thinking...what about simply asking the band to play softer?
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1975 Olds Recording trumpet
1997 Getzen 700SP trumpet
1955 Olds Super cornet
1939 Buescher 280 flugelhorn
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