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jadickson Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Jun 2006 Posts: 1295 Location: Raleigh, NC
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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During the Mt Vernon era, the 10.5C was the second most popular mouthpiece. 7C was first. This according to the Bach mouthpiece manual from that time, of which I have a copy.
And most people say the Mt V and Curry are smaller than the modern ones. _________________ Justin Dickson
Middle school band director. Still learning.
www.BandmateTuner.com |
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atrumpeter Veteran Member
Joined: 03 Apr 2012 Posts: 157 Location: Greensboro, NC
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Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2023 6:48 am Post subject: |
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AnthonyinVT wrote: | Pick up a BACH CORP 10 1/2C on ebay, produced from 1965-1969. It has a flat rim and a rim dimmension close to a 6C CORP. The 10 1/2 C Mt. Vernon, (no dots, produced from 1960 - 64 are the smallest I've ever seen. More rounded and thicker rim. I have two of them. The 10 1/2 C Mt. Vernon (dots) produced from 1954-59 is noticebly larger than the 60 -64, rim thinner and flatter. The 10 1/2 C CORP is a bit larger than the 54-59 Mt. Vernon. Reasonably priced on ebay because it's not a Mt. Venon and worth looking at, if that is the size you like. I don't have a modern 10 1/2 C to compare to the CORP piece. |
I have looked on eBay and no one has dates of production listed on the 10.5 C's unfortunately. _________________ Adams A1 Tpt.
Olds Ambassador Tpt and Cornet
Warburton, Curry and Stork Mpcs.
Mostly musicals and church gigs with the occasional jazz jam |
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AnthonyinVT Regular Member
Joined: 19 Oct 2021 Posts: 20 Location: Montgomery Center VT
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Posted: Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:47 am Post subject: |
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[I have looked on eBay and no one has dates of production listed on the 10.5 C's unfortunately.]
Look for VINCENT BACH CORP 10-1/2C. That should be the production years 1965-1969.
Check out Bach Loyalist. There are pictures of mouthpieces from different eras and you can see what you are looking for. _________________ ARM |
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Winghorn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2006 Posts: 2164 Location: Olympia, Washington
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Posted: Sun Mar 26, 2023 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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I have an all original, Mt. Vernon Bach 10 1/2C trumpet mouthpiece in excellent condition. It feels a little smaller than a later 10 1/2C, but has a very comfortable (for me) rim.
I can play it for about 20 minutes and then it stops working for me. My normal mouthpiece is a Mt. Vernon 1 1/2C, a much larger mouthpiece.
During those 20 minutes, however, the 10 1/2 is a delight, being effortless to play and having a very compact, beautiful sound.
I believe that players who use smaller mouthpieces would love this vintage gem!
Steve |
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plankowner110 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Jun 2003 Posts: 3621
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atrumpeter Veteran Member
Joined: 03 Apr 2012 Posts: 157 Location: Greensboro, NC
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Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 5:30 am Post subject: |
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Thanks AnthonyinVT. I am happy with my current Bach 10.5C (may be in that era too. Might be interesting to compare against other Bachs at some point.
Winghorn, the description you have it pretty accurate, except it doesn't break down after the 20 minutes for me (at least so far!), but it is not only effortless, also has very crisp articulations, and ease of playing above the staff and getting a very nice tone for legit type stuff too. It may be the Adams A1 that is the other factor making this combo good - not sure. Now for playing with more veiled attacks for jazz, this piece is not right for that, for me at least. _________________ Adams A1 Tpt.
Olds Ambassador Tpt and Cornet
Warburton, Curry and Stork Mpcs.
Mostly musicals and church gigs with the occasional jazz jam |
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Seymor B Fudd Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015 Posts: 1474 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 6:34 am Post subject: |
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When I began playing lead in the swing band 1968-9 I looked for mouthpieces to help me. First thing I bought was the Vincent Bach Corp 10 1/2 C but having played for some time I bought a Bach 1 1/4 C, together with my new King (1970) - ´cause my dealer told me to do so. And I stayed with the 1 1/4 C finding the 10 1/2 C too "cramped", in comparison bad projection and overall sound.
Today I guess that as the 10 1/2 C has a much smaller diameter (according to the Vincent Bach Mouthpiece manual from 2002), 15,90 mm; is somewhat more shallow, has a smaller cup, I wasn´t able to focus my chops well enough.
The 1 1/4 C felt much more 'free', had (has, I had to borrow one the other day) a magnificient projection. And my comfortable range was up to high E. with optional F F# Gs.
Maybe I should try the 10 1/2 C again?? Lately I haven taken lessons...... _________________ Cornets: mp 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974) |
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BreakFromTheHerd Veteran Member
Joined: 12 Apr 2022 Posts: 140
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Posted: Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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I picked up a 1980s Bach Corp. 10 1/2C as an experiment. I wanted to see if I could play it, having heard that Jack Sheldon played a 10 1/2C from the 1960s onward. I really love his sound.
Unfortunately, it didn't work well for me. It felt kinda stuffy, though I liked the diameter.
I then bought an Artisan 10 1/2C, thinking it would open things up a bit due to the larger backbore. Bingo. No more stuffiness.
Last edited by BreakFromTheHerd on Wed Dec 20, 2023 5:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Winghorn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2006 Posts: 2164 Location: Olympia, Washington
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 1:51 am Post subject: |
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In my Mt. Vernon Bach mouthpiece brochure, the 10 1/2C is described as “the best all-around mouthpiece”, used in many symphony orchestras and dance bands.
The Mt. Vernon brochure further states that the Bach 1 1/4C is the model played by Vincent Bach himself.
I played a “new old-stock” Mt. Vernon Bach 1 1/4C for many years until my wife inadvertently tossed it out. Luckily, I also had a “new old- stock” Mt. Vernon 1 1/2C. It actually took me several months to get used to its smaller cup diameter, but I have been playing on it ever since.
I currently have fifteen Bach 1 1/2C mouthpieces of every vintage, and twelve Bach 3C mouthpieces of all ages. What can I say? I love Bach mouthpieces! |
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Rogerrr Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Feb 2020 Posts: 144 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 6:09 am Post subject: |
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I'm curious about the 10 1/2 C vs the Olds 3...I have both and am deciding between the two...The 10 1/2C works a little better for me, but the Olds 3 is also good after I warm up with it a little
they seem to have similar-ish shapes:
https://trumpet.cloud/mpc/index.html?mpc1id=A006200&mpc2id=B041725 _________________ Sax player learning cornet & trumpet...and occasionally a little bit of trombone.
( so don't confuse me with an experienced player ) |
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JayKosta Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018 Posts: 3318 Location: Endwell NY USA
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 6:15 am Post subject: |
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From that scan, it appears to me that the 10 1/2C would feel slightly larger (rim ID) on the lips.
How would your describe their rim 'feel' - in both playing and non-playing contact? _________________ Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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Rogerrr Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Feb 2020 Posts: 144 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 6:40 am Post subject: |
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10 1/2 C seems maybe to feel larger, but not dramatically...when playing definitely easier to get good tone on low notes...with Olds 3 low notes are stuffy at first & only get somewhat better as I warm up _________________ Sax player learning cornet & trumpet...and occasionally a little bit of trombone.
( so don't confuse me with an experienced player ) |
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JayKosta Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018 Posts: 3318 Location: Endwell NY USA
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:43 am Post subject: |
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Rogerrr wrote: | ... with Olds 3 low notes are stuffy at first & only get somewhat better as I warm up |
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I wonder if that is due to how the curved bottom of the cup merges to the constant diameter of the throat section. _________________ Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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markp Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 2815 Location: Coarsegold, CA
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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The 10 1/2 shoe size is also amazing! I want to shout it to the rooftops and get some for all my friends and family! Same thing. Glad it’s your size. |
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dr_trumpet Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Nov 2001 Posts: 2534 Location: Cope, IN
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Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2023 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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JayKosta wrote: | Rogerrr wrote: | ... with Olds 3 low notes are stuffy at first & only get somewhat better as I warm up |
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I wonder if that is due to how the curved bottom of the cup merges to the constant diameter of the throat section. |
I have an Olds 3 here with that very problem. The cup/throat connection is very sharp, with little taper. Kept it for nostaglia, not for use! _________________ Dr. Albert L. Lilly, III DM
Artist/Clinician for Vincent Bach Trumpets (Conn-Selmer)
Principal Trumpet, Hendricks Symphony (Avon, IN)
Arranger/Composer; Lilly Music |
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MisterBighorn Regular Member
Joined: 31 Oct 2022 Posts: 22
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2023 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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I have a 10 1/2C. I love it until my lips swell. Then it shuts down on me, and I have to reach for something larger. |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9379 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2023 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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jadickson wrote: | During the Mt Vernon era, the 10.5C was the second most popular mouthpiece. 7C was first. This according to the Bach mouthpiece manual from that time, of which I have a copy.
And most people say the Mt V and Curry are smaller than the modern ones. |
I had a Mt Vernon 10-1/2C and a somewhat modern 10-1/2C at the same time, and the Mt V mouthpiece had a significantly more shallow and smaller diameter cup than the more modern one. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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RandyTX Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 Posts: 5299 Location: Central Texas
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2023 10:20 am Post subject: |
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dr_trumpet wrote: | JayKosta wrote: | Rogerrr wrote: | ... with Olds 3 low notes are stuffy at first & only get somewhat better as I warm up |
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I wonder if that is due to how the curved bottom of the cup merges to the constant diameter of the throat section. |
I have an Olds 3 here with that very problem. The cup/throat connection is very sharp, with little taper. Kept it for nostaglia, not for use! |
Yeah, I don't think it's an accident that people don't speak longingly of a long-lost Olds mouthpiece very often. I have a 3 as well, that might have ten minutes (if that) of playing time on it since I got it, many years ago. Great horns, nothing remotely exciting about any examples of their mouthpieces that I've encountered. _________________ "Music is like candy, you throw the (w)rappers away." |
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Rogerrr Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Feb 2020 Posts: 144 Location: USA
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2023 10:27 am Post subject: |
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In contrast I have an old Conn 2 mouthpiece that I love _________________ Sax player learning cornet & trumpet...and occasionally a little bit of trombone.
( so don't confuse me with an experienced player ) |
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