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rhatheway Veteran Member
Joined: 02 Apr 2024 Posts: 197 Location: Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 5:48 am Post subject: What are pocket trumpets used for? |
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Starting a new thread here because I've seen and heard of these, but have never actually played one.
Pocket trumpets. Why?
As I understand it (and I'll be the first to admit that I've only recently learned about them, so don't know anything about them), they're a Bb trumpet, but a much smaller scale. They're not a piccolo trumpet or a C trumpet though, so what's the reason for their existence? To take with you when traveling so you can practice? To have a backup horn just in case? Or something else?
Just curious, because I really don't know. As always, any insights/information is greatly appreciated. _________________ Richard H
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Working on getting my chops back...
“Without music, life would be a mistake” ― Friedrich Nietzsche
1968 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1958 Conn Director 14A |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9068 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:07 am Post subject: |
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Portability. Used to carry one around in case I came upon a jam session or another band to sit in with. Also to take on vacation with me to save room when packing.
In rare cases, someone uses it as their primary instrument. Don Cherry comes to mind, but characteristically, he's in his own world. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
"I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis." Attributed to Chet
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet |
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cgaiii Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Jun 2017 Posts: 1558 Location: Virginia USA
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:28 am Post subject: |
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I have one that I use when I travel. It is compact and fits in my carry-on luggage (backpack) with whatever else I need in there (computer, etc.)
A pocket trumpet has the same length of tubing as a full sized Bb trumpet, just with a tighter wrap.
There are tons of cheap unplayable pocket trumpets, but recently, a number of very playable ones have appeared at reasonable prices. I have a Manchester Brass one, which is made in Taiwan by the Carol Brass people, as I understand it. Trent Austin of Austin Custom Brass had input on the design. It is fun to play, and has a bit of a cornet-like feel to it, possibly related to the wrap. I have found it very useful for keeping the old lip alive while traveling. I use a practice mute (EZ Bucket Silencer) and can practice just about anywhere. Great fun to have a horn with you if you meet musicians in your travels too. Recently, I have taken to practicing on it using a natural trumpet mouthpiece to get double benefits from short practices during travel. _________________ Bb: Schilke X3L AS, Yamaha YTR-6335S
C: Schilke CXL, Kanstul 1510-2
Bb Cornet: Getzen 800 DLXS
Pic: Kanstul 920
Bb Bugle: Kanstul
Bb Pocket: Manchester Brass
Flugel: Taylor Std
Bass Tr: BAC Custom
Nat. Tr: Nikolai Mänttäri Morales Haas replica |
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Quadstriker Veteran Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2021 Posts: 115
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:32 am Post subject: |
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Vacation horn.
Because you never know when a fun opportunity to play will come up... such as a Caribbean baseball tournament.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/PO1UMfTOe_8 |
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Halflip Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Jan 2003 Posts: 1947 Location: WI
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:48 am Post subject: |
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In a live setting, they are wonderful conversation starters.
Plus, in a pinch, my girlfriend can use a couple as earrings. _________________ "He that plays the King shall be welcome . . . " (Hamlet Act II, Scene 2, Line 1416)
"He had no concept of the instrument. He was blowing into it." -- Virgil Starkwell's cello teacher in "Take the Money and Run" |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9068 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:53 am Post subject: |
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"Recently, I have taken to practicing on it using a natural trumpet mouthpiece to get double benefits from short practices during travel."
Intrigued. What does that mean, please? _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
"I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis." Attributed to Chet
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet |
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huntman10 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Aug 2017 Posts: 711 Location: Texas South Plains
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:10 am Post subject: |
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I was an engineer in a corporate office before retiring about 15 years ago. I had a funky school bus yellow pocket trumpet in my personal file drawer, and would play happy birthday when we had birthdays in the office. I even had a request from a boss to play "charge" to grab attention for a few gatherings.
I currently keep a "salvaged" Jupiter pocket trumpet at our lake trailer now for similar purposes (it is a gathering spot for the extended family, and a few of them are offended if I forget), and occasionally taps for Memorial Day or other occasions for the neighborhood.
I had hand surgery on my left hand last Fall and couldn't hold a full size trumpet, so I used my CarolBrass mini Bb for a couple of rehearsals, and it sounded fine.
I played "Amazing Grace" last August for a family gathering at a lodge at a remote New Mexico location at the rim of a 1,000 foot canyon. That was with a CarolBrass big bell C pocket trumpet with a really rich tone. Everyone liked that.
https://canyonmadnessranch.com/ _________________ huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc. |
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onlyson Veteran Member
Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 228 Location: Bartlett, Illinois
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:27 am Post subject: |
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I have played one for the last 30 years as my principal stage trumpet. Yes it is a great conversation starter. I play a black lacquered Carol horn with the full size bell. I wore out the last one. I started using it because I'm primarily the lead singer and guitar player/band leader who hauls all the P.A. gear. It fit's inside my gig bag, so it's one less thing to carry independently. I'll sometimes bring a nicer full size horn or two for a high profile private gig. _________________ Del Quadro Grizzly
Yamaha 9335CH
1951 Martin Committee Deluxe #3 Bore
ACB Coppernicus
Couesnon Flugel
Carol Pocket Trumpet |
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Halflip Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Jan 2003 Posts: 1947 Location: WI
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:32 am Post subject: |
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huntman10 wrote: | I played "Amazing Grace" last August for a family gathering at a lodge at a remote New Mexico location at the rim of a 1,000 foot canyon. |
What a wonderful thing to do. I can just picture it.
Thanks for sharing that, huntman. _________________ "He that plays the King shall be welcome . . . " (Hamlet Act II, Scene 2, Line 1416)
"He had no concept of the instrument. He was blowing into it." -- Virgil Starkwell's cello teacher in "Take the Money and Run" |
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cgaiii Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Jun 2017 Posts: 1558 Location: Virginia USA
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:51 am Post subject: |
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kehaulani wrote: | "Recently, I have taken to practicing on it using a natural trumpet mouthpiece to get double benefits from short practices during travel."
Intrigued. What does that mean, please? |
My natural trumpet mouthpiece just barely fits in the receiver of the pocket trumpet, but it works (don't have to pull out the tuning slide at all). The natural trumpet mouthpiece is large (19.5 or 20 mm) and is built very differently from a modern mouthpiece, requiring a bit of different technique to play. Since I play a lot on the natural trumpet as a rule but definitely cannot travel with one, this helps me stay in shape for the natural trumpet as well as the modern trumpet. I had tried other methods, such as using a natural trumpet leadpipe and converter to simulate a natural trumpet ala:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clb6TZwaPHM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DcpCdWEue4
But discovering that I could use the mouthpiece by itself reduced the amount of stuff I have to travel with. Now I rarely even bother with the hack, I just play fingerings and use the natural trumpet mouthpiece. It serves to keep me in shape enough while traveling.
I hope that answers your question. _________________ Bb: Schilke X3L AS, Yamaha YTR-6335S
C: Schilke CXL, Kanstul 1510-2
Bb Cornet: Getzen 800 DLXS
Pic: Kanstul 920
Bb Bugle: Kanstul
Bb Pocket: Manchester Brass
Flugel: Taylor Std
Bass Tr: BAC Custom
Nat. Tr: Nikolai Mänttäri Morales Haas replica |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9068 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 9:01 am Post subject: |
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Understand. Thanks for taking the time to answer. Cheers, K- _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
"I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis." Attributed to Chet
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet |
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rhatheway Veteran Member
Joined: 02 Apr 2024 Posts: 197 Location: Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 10:04 am Post subject: |
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OK, that makes a lot of sense. Small, light weight, easy to pack/carry...
But..., now several of you mentioned a "natural trumpet." What the heck is that?
I tell ya, I really enjoy this forum because it seems that every day I'm learning something new! So don't be surprised when I keep asking questions... _________________ Richard H
------------------------------------------
Working on getting my chops back...
“Without music, life would be a mistake” ― Friedrich Nietzsche
1968 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1958 Conn Director 14A
Last edited by rhatheway on Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9068 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:02 am Post subject: |
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rhatheway wrote: | But..., now several of you mentioned a "natural trumpet." What the heck is that? |
google is your best friend. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
"I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis." Attributed to Chet
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet |
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shofarguy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Sep 2007 Posts: 7013 Location: AZ
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:45 am Post subject: |
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"Is that a trumpet in your pocket, or..."
I don't know about nowadays, but about 10 years ago the Kanstul 905 or the related vintage Benge pocket trumpets were considered the best playing, sounding pocket trumpets. I tried a 905 at the showroom, back in the day, and it did play well. The problem I had was that it was too darn close to my ears! After 20+ years of carpentry and another ten or so of marching band, I had to pass. _________________ Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds. |
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Jon Peck New Member
Joined: 24 Apr 2024 Posts: 5 Location: Rochester, NY
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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I have a Mendini by Cecilio pocket trumpet, got it for portable practice and as an occasional spare.
It's great for fingering practice like drilling Clarke's or long tones, and it can just sit on my desk when I'm not using it.
The back pressure and precision are awful, but that's the compromise.
It's not a serious tool, but it has its uses. To quote Marge Simpson, "I just think they're neat!" |
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rhatheway Veteran Member
Joined: 02 Apr 2024 Posts: 197 Location: Texas
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Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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kehaulani wrote: | rhatheway wrote: | But..., now several of you mentioned a "natural trumpet." What the heck is that? |
google is your best friend. |
I did that, but the Wiki article really doesn't explain it well. To me it sounds like a natural trumpet is what I would call a bugle, just longer.
But is that right? _________________ Richard H
------------------------------------------
Working on getting my chops back...
“Without music, life would be a mistake” ― Friedrich Nietzsche
1968 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1958 Conn Director 14A |
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dershem Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 1889 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Mon May 06, 2024 8:04 am Post subject: |
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I keep one in my car, just in case I need a trumpet for something, or if I'm on the road and don't have room for a regular trumpet, just to have something to practice on. Not having a big budget, my pocket trumpet does not have great intonation, but it' adequate for long tones and flexibilities.
I once showed up at a band where I was playing 1st trombone, and 2 of the trumpet players didn't show up, so I played lead all night on my pocket trumpet. Intonation was tough, and blend was hard, but it worked.
So... yeah, mostly for off-hand use. _________________ BKA! Mic Gillette was my mentor and friend.
Marcinkiewicz Mic G. trumpet, Custom Marcinkiewicz mpc. (Among others)
Marcinkiewicz Rembrandt flugel, Benge 8Z cornet, King 2B, Bach 36, Benge 190, Getzen 3062... many more. All Marc. mouthpieces. |
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Jon Peck New Member
Joined: 24 Apr 2024 Posts: 5 Location: Rochester, NY
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Posted: Mon May 06, 2024 9:19 am Post subject: |
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rhatheway wrote: | To me it sounds like a natural trumpet is what I would call a bugle, just longer.
But is that right? | Sort of, there's a couple of differences.
Natural Trumpets are 2-3 times longer than Bugles.
The greater length of a natural trumpet means more harmonic overtones are available, which provides more usable notes in the playable range.
Conversely, it's easier to play chromatics on a bugle than a natural trumpet.
Bugle bells are more conical, and Natural Trumpet bells are more cup-like. |
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DAVIDTHEWRITER Regular Member
Joined: 23 Apr 2024 Posts: 35 Location: SoCal, USA
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Posted: Mon May 06, 2024 9:32 am Post subject: |
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kehaulani wrote: | "Recently, I have taken to practicing on it using a natural trumpet mouthpiece to get double benefits from short practices during travel."
Intrigued. What does that mean, please? |
My only experience with a defective Allora P T was standard trumpet 7C mouthpiece. |
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TrumpetMD Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Oct 2008 Posts: 2424 Location: Maryland
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Posted: Mon May 06, 2024 9:34 am Post subject: |
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dershem wrote: | I keep one in my car.... |
Same here. I keep a mouthpiece in my glove compartment, and my pocket trumpet in my trunk. I mostly use it to practice at work or on vacation. I've also used it on an occasional gig, more as a novelty than anything else.
To answer the OP's question "why?" ... For availability and portability.
Mike _________________ Bach Stradivarius 43* Trumpet (1974), Bach 6C Mouthpiece.
Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns. |
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