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stukvalve Veteran Member
Joined: 22 Nov 2002 Posts: 371 Location: Rochester, NY
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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Hey guys, another question for you ...
did bud play an Eb trumpet for the posthorn solo on the solti box set recording of mahler 3?
what equipment is everyone using for the posthorn solo?
Thanks! -Max- _________________ "It's not about working hard, It's about being organized." -Wynton Marsalis
matzentrpt@hotmail.com |
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MrClean Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2003 Posts: 2734 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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Goodbye.
Last edited by MrClean on Sat Sep 25, 2004 6:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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pitchlevel Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2003 Posts: 537 Location: Guanajuato, Mexico
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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jim, do you use the beret in performance or just at auditions? |
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MrClean Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2003 Posts: 2734 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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Goodbye.
Last edited by MrClean on Sat Sep 25, 2004 6:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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JRoyal Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Apr 2003 Posts: 770
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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Bernie Adelstien played it on a flugel at some point, and i think Phil Smith played it on a shepards crook cornet. i am not sure about Bud. |
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robert_white Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Feb 2003 Posts: 1583
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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I remember the liner notes for the LP from the recording CSO did with Levine, and it said
(regarding the posthorn solo) "here played on a C trumpet into a felt hat high above the Medinah Temple stage from the upper balcony", or something like that. It's probably reasonable to assume he did something similar on the Solti recording.
Bob
PS
A friend of mine is in Civic, and they're having a sectional with Mr. H on Friday. I'll be visiting, so if I get a chance to ask him, I will.
[ This Message was edited by: robert_white on 2003-05-28 20:22 ] |
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trombapaul2 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Oct 2002 Posts: 1889 Location: Detroit, MI
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Posted: Wed May 28, 2003 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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Phil Smith mentions on his orchestral excerpts CD that he prefers
a shepherds crook C cornet (me too!)
Paul
_________________
"For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?"
(I Corinthians 14:8)
[ This Message was edited by: trombapaul2 on 2003-05-28 21:25 ] |
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Tal Katz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 781 Location: Israel
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 12:06 am Post subject: |
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The Israel Philharmonic did it like a month ago conducted by Benjamin Zander and I went to listen to their rehersal before my lesson with Yigal (principal trumpet) and he tried doing it on a flugel some rehersals before but he decided doing it on a C trumpet... just a C trumpet with no hats...
I was in their rehersal that he played on a C trumpet and it sounded incredible ! amazing !
Tal Katz,
Young Israel Philharmonic,
Israel
[ This Message was edited by: Tal Katz on 2003-05-29 03:07 ] |
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King1500 Veteran Member
Joined: 01 Mar 2002 Posts: 218 Location: London, Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 1:44 am Post subject: |
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Has anyone heard the LSO recording of this with Tilson Thomas conducting and Maurice Murphy playing the posthorn solo? He played it on Flugel for that recording and it is one of the best I have heard.
Craig |
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TossedSalad Veteran Member
Joined: 06 May 2003 Posts: 236
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 6:00 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
On 2003-05-29 03:06, Tal Katz wrote:
The Israel Philharmonic did it like a month ago conducted by Benjamin Zander and I went to listen to their rehersal before my lesson with Yigal (principal trumpet) and he tried doing it on a flugel some rehersals before but he decided doing it on a C trumpet... just a C trumpet with no hats...
I was in their rehersal that he played on a C trumpet and it sounded incredible ! amazing !
Tal Katz,
Young Israel Philharmonic,
Israel
<font size=-2>[ This Message was edited by: Tal Katz on 2003-05-29 03:07 ]</font>
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Was that the Raja Samadi or Raja 3?
TossedSalad |
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Tal Katz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 781 Location: Israel
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 6:40 am Post subject: |
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Actually...
It was Yigal's Bach C trumpet with a Malone leadpipe and been goldplated by Malone too and Yigal told me Malone put it in a kind of an oven or something like that...
And a monette mouthpiece.
Cheers
Tal
[ This Message was edited by: Tal Katz on 2003-05-29 09:42 ] |
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gus Veteran Member
Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Posts: 452
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 6:49 am Post subject: |
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Bud in a Masterclass early this year in Miami this year told that he played the post horn with a Eb Cornet, with flugel mouthpiece ( Strange
isn't it ? ).
Gus |
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TossedSalad Veteran Member
Joined: 06 May 2003 Posts: 236
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 6:53 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
On 2003-05-29 09:49, gus wrote:
Bud in a Masterclass early this year in Miami this year told that he played the post horn with a Eb Cornet, with flugel mouthpiece ( Strange
isn't it ? ).
Gus
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Don't knock it, till you try it. works on Eb trumpet as well!
TossedSalad |
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stukvalve Veteran Member
Joined: 22 Nov 2002 Posts: 371 Location: Rochester, NY
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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see, i heard the same thing, only he used a felt hat with the Eb trumpet. my teacher who was a chicowicz student at the time they recorded all the mahlers told me this, i still a little questionable about the validity of it. he also mentioned that he did play a C on the levine recording as well. does anyone know wher i can get a cd of the levine recording? thanks! -max- _________________ "It's not about working hard, It's about being organized." -Wynton Marsalis
matzentrpt@hotmail.com |
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greg99799 Regular Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2003 Posts: 49 Location: Sarasota
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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The one time I've been fortunate enough to perform the solo, I used an Eb(Yamaha, Schilke E3L look-alike) with a Crown Royal bag...worked like a dream. |
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ZeroMan Heavyweight Member
Joined: 21 Jul 2002 Posts: 1112
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2003 8:45 pm Post subject: |
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According to the Cornet Compendium, Gustav Mahler originally scored the solo for flügelhorn, then scratched out the word flügelhorn and wrote posthorn instead. Since a cornet is actually a descendant of the valved posthorn, I guess it could be considered appropriate, and I hear that many players (like Phil Smith) use a cornet for the solo.
I also read (in the Compendium) that Bud Herseth used a C trumpet and a felt hat. I cant' remember for which recording though. There seems to be a lot of different stories floating around out there. Maybe one day Mr. Herseth will set the story straight.
The moral of my senseless spiel is, play it with what sounds best for you and/or the conductor at the moment, because even the masters are not in agreement.
_________________
Peace & Love,
Thos.
[ This Message was edited by: ZeroMan on 2003-05-29 23:48 ] |
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mileage Veteran Member
Joined: 21 Mar 2003 Posts: 108 Location: London
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2003 1:17 am Post subject: |
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I saw the LSO do Mahler 3 a few years ago and Maurice Murphy played first trumpet in the orchestra then went off to play the offstage solo (on Flugal by the sound of it) then came back on to finish the piece! He was probably working all morning and afternoon as well. |
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johntpt 'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 07 Feb 2002 Posts: 2284 Location: Toluca, Mexico
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2003 4:33 am Post subject: |
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The Chicago Symphony has played this piece many times over the years, and Bud did not always use the same instrument. All of the above suggestions are true. I have a recording of the first time they played the piece (1967, Jean Martinon conducting) where the liner notes says "Bud Herseth adeptly handled the third-movement posthorn solos on a three-valve instrument." That doesn't help much, but it sounds like was probably a C trumpet.
The liner notes to the Levine recording from the 1970s says that he was playing a C trumpet blown into a hat far above the stage. Unfortunately this recording is out of print, except for Japan. It could be ordered from various Japanese websites (HMV, Tower, etc) but it would be very expensive. This shows up used on Ebay from time to time.
Later is his career Bud used Eb instruments for this solo, and it would be possible that sometimes he used an Eb trumpet and sometimes an Eb cornet.
Ghitalla actually found some sort of a posthorn and used that on the Boston/Leinsdorf recording from the 1960s.
John Urness |
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allofyougetalife Veteran Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2003 Posts: 207
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2003 4:40 am Post subject: |
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I heard a story that Sinopoli did this with NY Phil, and that during a rehearsal he presented Phil Smith with a posthorn, saying "this is the instrument Mahler heard at the first performance" - YIKES!!!
Phil nodded, took backstage and played his C cornet like he usually does. When he came back out, Sinopoli was "beaming" saying something like "I knew it would sound wonderful."
AOYGAL
[ This Message was edited by: allofyougetalife on 2003-05-30 07:41 ] |
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