How do you get lots of volume into a tiny mpc?

tradjazzman · Veteran Member Joined: 15 Nov 2002 Posts: 176

Well let me add my 2 cents also. I'm right now tring for about my 50th time, in my 30+ years of playing / to go from a semi-shallow piece (a Bach 7D) to a shallower piece (a Curry 50M). I've in the past always seemed ok with the med-shallow Schilkie B cups, etc.... but when I take that step down to the real boys... I have that typical killer sound / range that lasts about 15-20 minutes!! Then I bottom out, and the sound turns to crap, and I throw it back in my case, and get out the semi-shallow cup. (LOL). I work with them for a week or so, then I give up. But I think the key here is I can get that nice sound/ range / brightness/ lead sound I want for 15-20 mintues. Sooooooo I must be doing something right, and of course something wrong too! But maybe I'm 1/2 way there.

I've been reading alot of this stuff said and I'm going to give it a few months this time / and work with the smaller/ shallower piece a bit each day. As recommended to me by a friend that I can HEAR and SEE the results when we switches to a smaller piece. Usually I think I just go all out when getting one, instead of slower working with it? Well patience is not one of my know good points. I want to play like Chase, and I want to play like him TODAY!!!!! (LOL)

But seriously.........I do think that one big part for me is to NOT try to blow as much air into the smaller piece as I do when using my C / or D cup. A good friend of mine showed me how I actually try to use way to much air when playing up high. It takes alot LESS air to blow a high F then it does a Low C. The air just needs to travel FASTER up top. Too much air will sufficate the sound (and US TOO). Did you ever get lightheaded when playing up top? **** man.... I have. It's a scary and ugly feeling too! THEN.... it seems like the air is backing up. So my advice (and I hope I take it too) is to make sure I do NOT OVERBLOW the mouthpiece. And of course try to back off on the lip pressure too! Another of my major faults.

Easier said then done. GOOD LUCK. I hope toread more about this in the future. It's a topic most trumpet players would love to figure out. I know I sure would.

Ben Mauger

LeeC · Heavyweight Member Joined: 25 Feb 2003 Posts: 5730

What I like about this topic is that all of us shallower mouthpiece guys can discuss these issues without a lot of flack from the huge mouthpiece dogmatic types. Jesus what a relief!

I had the good fortune to meet Bill Chase in 1972. At that time I was one of those BIG MOUTHPIECE types. Bill straightened me out on that concept really quick. What guy he was! If you listen to some of Bill's lower and middle register solos he sounds a lot bigger in tone than the 6a4a would usually sound. Of course you don't hear a lot of low register solos from his recordings (lol).

I think the "secret" to the smaller mouthpiece issues in the middle register is to develop a lot of volume there. True it may not sound as mellow as the bigger pieces, but the sound still is good and fairly versitile provided you don't go really shallow.

Of course there are players that will never be able to play the smaller pieces no matter what and so these suggestions are irrelevant to them. Also, some don't need a smaller piece to play with good facility upstairs.

Wish TH had a spell check, or maybe it does. Clue me in on this one folks.

Lee

Emb_Enh · Veteran Member Joined: 29 Oct 2002 Posts: 455

...getting a big sound from a small mpc is ALL about lip vibrancy....

...for the lips to be ultra vibrant [efficient] and rich in overtones, control of the quieter dynamics is paramount....

....once you get the control of the quieter dynamics IN the center of pitch without lipjaw manipulation opposite to your NATURAL set up, it becomes a game of endurance building at this volume to strengthen the corners.

.....when you have done prolonged sessions over a period of time doing the above, the LOUDER volumes come easily with very little effort.

...oh yeh...AND you get increased range as a by-product...

...UNLESS....you wanna cheat and open up throats/change lip position etc etc...
_________________
Regards, Roddy o-iii RoddyTpt@aol.com

"E M B O U C H U R E___E N H A N C E M E N T"
BOOK 1 also... BOOK 2 + demo CD

[Self Analysis and Diagnostic Trumpet Method]

smithwatkinsguy · Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2003 8:28 am Post subject:

TrumpetMom,
My bit of thinking on this about your question of teeth allignment is that I think that you might be having troubles with smaller diameter pieces that you think you need on a shallow mouthpiece. If your teeth that you say overlap your two front teeth are in the way then it's obviously going to be uncomfortable and in any situation, you're going to back off because your body is telling you to do so. My suggestions are 1) get a bigger/smaller diameter that is comfortable in a larger cup and maybe get a custom job done so the same rim is on a shallow cup and 2) use LESS pressure. I have a Laskey 80* that has just too high of an alpha angle for me to deal with so when I do play the occasional high stuff with this thing it kills me and that's why I can't play very high on it. My lips aren't meant for this sharp of a rim! If your lips are thin then this mouthpiece may work for you but if your lips are a little more fleshier than normal, than I would recommend staying away from sharp bites on the rim. It might not be you but the mouthpieces you're choosing. You can't just pick up any shallow mouthpiece and expect it to work. As everybody has stated it takes time and patience to switch over, more than it would to switch to just any mouthpiece because it's significantly different! Good luck and oh, btw guys, I am a BIG MOUTHPIECE guy, but I respect anybody who uses their choice of equipment, if you sound good on it - play it!
_________________
Aaron G.
Bach Strad Bb 37G bell/Stork 1
Bach Strad C 229G bell, 25H pipe/Stork 1
Rhode Island All-State Orchestra
The Hartt School of Music

Castle Bravo · Heavyweight Member Joined: 13 Apr 2003 Posts: 542

trptsbaker · Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2003 7:58 pm Post subject:

Switching to a "smaller" mpc. is just like switching to a "bigger" mpc., only in reverse. When it comes to mpcs., sometimes less is more. The trick is to get past the frustration. An efficent mpc. will do it's job exactly as it was designed to do, given a chance. T.

BobList · Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2003 4:28 am Post subject:

I've found that going from a bowl to a pea-shooter is all about not "kissing rosebuds" with the lips...they can, and will bottom out in a shallow cup. A good way to keep this from happening is to Buzz-walk into the mouthpiece, no horn. Then, after you can get a decent 2 octave scale doing that, buzz walk into the horn, and run a few scales, fairly softly. The key word is softly. Then after getting a decent sound....you can crescendo to FF and then back off.
A 6a4a feels like a medium deep cup to me, a 13a4a is for legit ( sarcasm), and my Holbert custom is for lead...all shallow pieces. If I want a dark sound, I have a Yamaha 631 flugel.
Bob List, Bawlmer, Murlyn