Why is Harry James often not spoken of?

Nicholas1090 · Regular Member Joined: 02 Aug 2011 Posts: 45

He is one of the greatest players to exist but it seems to me that most people hardly know him or never talk about him and prefer people like Louis Armstrong over him. I mean how can this be? Just listen to this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNWxwvIwC-Q

Larry Smithee · Heavyweight Member Joined: 11 Nov 2001 Posts: 4399

I love Harry too but you're giving the impression that Pops was just a minor figure next to Harry James. Is that right?

Larry

Nicholas1090 · Regular Member Joined: 02 Aug 2011 Posts: 45

What I'm saying is harry was such a better player than satchmo and yet so little attention is given to harry. And not just satchmo in particular but all the other players too. Hell, I hear about Chet Baker more than harry. Why is this?

crzytptman · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:49 pm Post subject:

How does one often not speak of? That doesn't make sense. How would you know if someone is often not speaking of Harry James, and not someone else?
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Nicholas1090 · Regular Member Joined: 02 Aug 2011 Posts: 45

Look, you get the idea OK. He is almost never mentioned and always brushed aside even though he was such a great player. Players with less ability are idolized and talked about more than him. I just wanted to know if there was a reason for this.

JakeMN · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:51 pm Post subject:

Louis was also a vocalist. I'm not sure if Harry was or not, not that I know of, but then again I haven't studied him as I have Louis. I believe that the general population(non-musicians) more easily relate to lyrics than instrumental pieces. I believe that Louis has a different audience in a way. You are much more likely to hear him on the radio(What a Wonderful World, Hello Dolly, etc), but I have never heard Harry on the radio. I just believe that, these days anyway, Louis is better exposed to this new generation of players. These are just some thoughts/guesses that I have come up with I guess. I wish Harry James was more widely known. Great player and I love his sound!

Irving · Heavyweight Member Joined: 11 Feb 2003 Posts: 1888

In his heyday Harry James was very well known, and might have been more popular than Louis Armstrong. He was one of the greatest trumpet players ever, no doubt about it. His music was very stylized, and became unpopular sometime after WW2. He played in different musical genres then, and even flirted with bebop. I don't think that he is listened to much today just because the types of music he used to play aren't listened to much. Louis Armstrongs music has a universal appeal that Harry's doesn't have. By the way, I wouldn't be so quick to underestimate Louis's trumpet playing. He made some truly amazing recordings (in a virtuoso trumpet sense) through the 1930's. I think that Harry and Louis both had a lot of respect for each other, and might have been friends.

tommy t. · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 5:56 pm Post subject:

I think that Harry played in a period that was right when "media" was beginning to be a factor in opinions. "Media" found Harry's life style to be scandalous and made a big thing out of it.

I grew up in the 50's and have clear memories of my parents talking about how often Harry managed to make the scandal side of the "society" pages.

He really was a sort of model for the kind of trumpet player that you didn't want your daughter to date.

I suspect that, given the prudishness of that period, Harry's trumpet playing took second stand to relationships with alcohol and women in the public eye And, as a result, his overall reputation for good trumpet work was just never established with the baby boomers.

Record publishers didn't do re-releases of his singles hits as lps; music publishers didn't print transcriptions of his solos because parents wouldn't buy them for their kids.

Tommy T.
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kehaulani · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:01 pm Post subject:

Also you can't discount the lasting effect that Louis has had on jazz as a whole vs Harry's contributions. Harry James definitely attracted many young people to the trumpet - Miles himself credits Harry James as one of his early influences - but Harry's style was not innovative and he spawned no particular school to carry his torch forward.

By contrast, Pops is the wellspring of jazz trumpet, who's influence is profound, not only to trumpet players, but to the entire field of jazz, if not with residual influences in the field on entertainment, in general. And, as noted above, he was an internationally known and beloved entertainer, which Harry was not, and that has also stood the test of time.

No doubt Harry James was a terrific player. IMO he hasn't gotten the credit that he's due. I believe that some of his big bands in the "post-big band" years were among the best ever and some of his solos were dead on the mark in this era, which is usually given short shrift my musical historians and the public in general.
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Mike Sailors · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:06 pm Post subject:

solo soprano · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:07 pm Post subject:

Harry was known among musicians for his astonishing technique and for having a superior tone. People will like trumpet players, but they will love a singer. Harry and Louis are the among the most famous trumpeters of the 20th century.

Mike Sailors · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:07 pm Post subject:

What you're really saying is that Harry James had more "chops". Trumpet players are the only people who think this way.
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MikeyMike · Heavyweight Member Joined: 06 Nov 2007 Posts: 1680

Spit valve · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:54 pm Post subject:

Harry was very popular in his time. I'd bet that he made more money than any other trumpet player ever.

I love his sound, but some people find him schmaltzy. Then again, when I was first starting the trumpet he was the most popular trumpet player by far.
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musicalmason1 · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:08 pm Post subject:

Hey man, you think Harry James is the best ever and deserves more recognition. That's cool. That is your opinion and you are most certainly welcomed to it. I've got nothing but respect for HJ, he was a great player. No doubt. That being said, I prefer guys like Chet and Louis because I don't listen to music to marvel at a guys chops. I listen to music because it moves me and evokes an emotional reaction within me. If there is chops on top of that, great. Guys like Chet and Louis (and many others) have moved me. I have listened to some Harry James, and I can't say I've ever been emotionally moved by his music. Maybe I should listen to more of him, and I will try to. I'm just saying, for me, it's about the music and the emotion, not the chops. That is why I think Louis and Chet get more recognition. More relate ability outside the world of trumpeting.

A.N.A.Mendez · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:38 pm Post subject:

Harry was a monster trumpet player, Louis was a medium for music. I love Harry, saw him twice, but Louis was music, he just used the trumpet and his voice to let it out, he could make you hear notes he didn't play, he was IT. Know Louis, know music, no Louis, no music.........
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etc-etc · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 6192

As for students, Harry James inspired a lot of followers.

I find, at times, that Doc Severinsen's playing resembles Harry James in the singing quality of the tone.

dmb · Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:27 pm Post subject:

HERMOKIWI · Heavyweight Member Joined: 24 Dec 2008 Posts: 2581

tommy t. · Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:41 am Post subject: