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Guy NoVa
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 Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:30 pm Post subject: Thomas Gansch |
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It's always cool to see a superstar musician playing outside their usual zone. Like Charlie Watts (Rolling Stones drummer, sorry if that is patronizing, but maybe not everyone can name all the Rolling Stones) drumming -- and having a ton of fun doing it -- with a Boogie Woogie group www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u1Qlzidrn0
Similarly, Thomas Gansch (Mnozil Brass) does a fantastic job with a Dixieland group:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGCfrWkmh-Q
But here's my question: WHAT is the name of that tune that Thomas Gansch and the Dixieland All Stars are playing in that clip??? I'd really love to know.
TIA
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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Doxy. Not really a dixie tune, but who's keeping score!?
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Larry Smithee
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike Sailors wrote: | | Doxy. Not really a dixie tune, but who's keeping score!? |
If they play Doxie like a dixie tune then it's a dixie tune.
Larry |
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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That's not correct, in my opinion.
That term denotes a certain time period as well as song structure, melodic structure, harmonic progressions, etc. Doxy doesn't really fit when you're talking about tunes like Muskrat Ramble.
If I played Chromazone like an etude (un-accompanied), would you consider it an etude?
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Larry Smithee
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike Sailors wrote: | | If I played Chromazone like an etude (un-accompanied), would you consider it an etude? |
Yes. If you play it like an etude then it's an etude. It gets worse. if you work Chromazone into a thematic idea and orchestrate it as a first movement for a symphony using sonata-allegero form it's now a symphony. Music is exceedingly adaptable.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Larry Smithee wrote: | | Mike Sailors wrote: | | If I played Chromazone like an etude (un-accompanied), would you consider it an etude? |
Yes. If you play it like an etude then it's an etude. It gets worse. if you work Chromazone into a thematic idea and orchestrate it as a first movement for a symphony using sonata-allegero form it's now a symphony. Music is exceedingly adaptable.
Larry |
Ahh . . . but now you're rearranging it, orchestrating it, super-imposing over a different form etc. That's different, and as you say, much "worse".
Doxy is not, and never was a Dixie tune or a trad tune. Yes, it can be played in the style, but so can Chromazone. (I hope to never hear that)
If I drive my Toyota like a Ferrari, is it then a Ferrari???
Why are we even debating this?
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crzytptman
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Doxy doesn't really fit when you're talking about tunes like Muskrat Ramble. |
Actually, it does. As demonstrated.
| Quote: | | song structure, melodic structure, harmonic progressions |
Precisely.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:13 am Post subject: |
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Let me get this straight; you think Muskrat Ramble and Doxy are similar?
I'd love to hear your rationale!
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:28 am Post subject: |
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The term "dixie" denotes a hell of alot more than just 3 horn players playing at the same time, just FYI.
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Brian Moon
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:50 am Post subject: Re: Thomas Gansch |
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www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGCfrWkmh-Q
Sounds like Dixie to me.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:55 am Post subject: |
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Just to set the record straight before all you guys start arguing at me. I said that Doxy was not a Dixieland tune. Yes, they're playing it like it is and it sounds good!
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crzytptman
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:11 am Post subject: |
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| Mike Sailors wrote: | Let me get this straight; you think Muskrat Ramble and Doxy are similar?
I'd love to hear your rationale!
The term "dixie" denotes a hell of alot more than just 3 horn players playing at the same time, just FYI. |
Don't be so shallow. You said "like" Muskrat Ramble, which I took to mean similar to the "genre"- not as like puncuation like y'know so many people like use the word.
To me, it sounds like Mr. Rollins wrote the tune as reminiscent of the older style. Similar to others tunes such as Jelly Roll or Better Git it in Your Soul. The progressions follow a familiar sequence that lend to the lines that can improvised by "3 horn players playing at the same time, just FYI." That's why they work so well being played in that style (The term "dixie" denotes a hell of alot more than just 3 horn players playing at the same time, just FYI, which is why I don't like to use it).
That's my observation, based on not having gone to college to study the music created by great artists who never went to college.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:31 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | That's my observation, based on not having gone to college to study the music created by great artists who never went to college. |
You like to throw this in my face a lot, so I'll address it.
Nate, I've worked with and been mentored by some of the people you're talking about. For instance, Rodney Whitaker, Jon Faddis, Butch Miles, Gerald Wilson and on an on. I'm not one to drop names (even though, yes, I just did), but you're inclination that I don't know what I'm talking about because I have 3 degrees (one of which is based in jazz btw) is incorrect.
I play this music almost every night, in the place where it's being performed at it's highest. I won't stand for your belittling what I've done and what I say just because I wanted to study with people who were great at the things that I wanted to be great at.
As far as the rest of what you wrote, well . . . I disagree. Doxy is not a dixieland tune. I can't believe anyone would argue that it is.
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AverageJoe
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:50 am Post subject: |
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Great playing by Gansch!
What Mike is saying is that Doxy was not conceived as a Dixieland tune. Can it be played in a Dixie style? Obviously yes.
Always amazes me how semantics is the #1 reason for internet debates...
Paul
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:12 am Post subject: |
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| AverageJoe wrote: | Great playing by Gansch!
What Mike is saying is that Doxy was not conceived as a Dixieland tune. Can it be played in a Dixie style? Obviously yes.
Always amazes me how semantics is the #1 reason for internet debates...
Paul |
Someone gets it! Thanks Paul!
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SatchmoGillespie
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:13 am Post subject: |
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| crzytptman wrote: |
To me, it sounds like Mr. Rollins wrote the tune as reminiscent of the older style. |
You're on to something. From what I recall, the tune was based off an old WW I era tune titled Ja-Da. That would explain why the changes fit so well with the style.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Most tunes written in the early 50's have it's roots in the Great American Songbook and earlier.
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SatchmoGillespie
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:21 am Post subject: |
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| Mike Sailors wrote: | | Most tunes written in the early 50's have it's roots in the Great American Songbook and earlier. |
Yes, I know. Thanks.
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crzytptman
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:23 am Post subject: |
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| Mike Sailors wrote: | | Quote: | | That's my observation, based on not having gone to college to study the music created by great artists who never went to college. |
You like to throw this in my face a lot, so I'll address it.
So, I make a statement about myself to qualify my perspective, and you think it's all about you. Brilliant.
As far as the rest of what you wrote, well . . . I disagree. Doxy is not a dixieland tune. I can't believe anyone would argue that it is.
Since I'm not arguing that it is, I wonder what you are disagreeing with.
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Mike Sailors
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:26 am Post subject: |
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I know what you meant. You've been saying it for years. No backstepping. You can make me the bully again if you like, but you're not fooling anyone.
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