Advantages/Disadvantages of a cornet

[Tim80]

What are the advantages and disadvantages of playing a cornet? I assume a cornet wouldn't project as well as a trumpet. What are the playing chracteristics of each compared to the other.
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All murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers and to the sound of trumpets.
Voltaire

[BeboppinFool]

Take a look at this topic:

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?topic=5220&forum=14&174

A lot of what you're asking has been answered there.

Rich
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Puttin’ On The Ritz

[DecentDude]

Where do we begin, and how do we NOT start an argument thread? LOL
In my opinion and experience:
You CAN produce a wonderfully sweet and mellow (see: Lyrical) voice, simply by the choice of cornet and mouthpiece you play, OR:
You CAN project, have a virtually trumpet-like sound and edge to your "voice", again depending on the choices mentioned above, OR:
You may strike whatever balance you desire, again via those options.
Now, that's not to say those very objectives cannot somehow be achieved by a skilled person playing a trumpet, but the warmth and intimacy of the true cornet sound is best produced by just that, a true cornet.
For some reason, and this is worthy of note, many of us find that playing a properly set-up cornet is less taxing to the chops and the body. It doesn't matter why, so long as it's true, right?
Earlier, when I mentioned choices as to which cornet and mouthpiece, I touched on the fact that there are two basic styles of cornet. The true shepherd's crook design (AKA "British"), when played with the proper, almost funnel-cupped m'piece, should give you the most mellow result. The common long-style (American) cornet will lend itself to a more edgy or bright sound,especially if played with the type of cornet mouthpieces so common here (basically, trumpet cups on cornet shanks.)
Between the two "extremes" aforementioned is a wide field of variations influenced by your choice of horn/m'piece combination, individual playing style, and other little "inputs".
Were I in your position, I'd select a shepherd's crook type with which to enter the cornet world. Kanstul Signature Model 1520, or Kanstul Custom Class 930 would be excellent choices and allow you some discretion so far as cost is concerned. There are other good choices out there, but shepherd's crook cornets are not a major segment of manufacture here in the USA. Kanstul design, quality, and devotion to customer satisfaction are of epic reputation and that's where I feel your search should begin.
Mouthpieces? Well, the choice of one of the horns I mentioned above will enable you to tailor your sound to virtually any taste simply via a change of mouthpiece. You should be able to find true cornet mouthpieces that will closely match the feel of your trumpet m'piece rim and from there you can simply swap around according to the demands of any particular occasion.
I use both long-model and shepherd's crook horns, and vary the mouthpieces as well, in order to tailor the sound to taste, but one cornet can do the job, so long as the m'piece and playing style are suited to the task.
Best of luck!

Decent Dude

Cornets Owned:
1950 Bach Strad ML
1953 Bach Strad M
1965 Bach Strad L
1911 Holton Coutourier
1953 Buescher 400
1950 King Silver Sonic
1965 King Silver Sonic
2 King Masters
Olds Recording
Lyon Healy (1920's?)
a few others as well.
(I do own some trumpets, honest! LOL)

And: I WANT a Kanstul!




[ This Message was edited by: DecentDude on 2003-09-23 08:25 ]

[fuzzyjon79]

Are cornets cylindrical or conical bores?
_________________
J. Fowler
"It takes a big ole' sack of flour, to make a big ole' pan of biscuits!"

[bophead]

Decent Dude's suggestion about the Kanstul line of instruments is right on target. I have been playing a Kanstul Custom Class Cornet (CCC930) for a few months now. I've found it to be a terrific instrument. It is very well made, in tune with itself (4th space 'E' played open, 1&2, 3; middle C both open and 2&3, all sing with only minor chops adjustment). The horn feels good in my hand (I've huge hands). There is an inherently warm tone the instrument produces by virtue of the bronze bell and shepard's crook. Although I am not certain of all of the physics involved, a lyrical sound is the least of my problems. I play it through a Warburton 3BC mouthpiece using a *8 backbore. Shortly after I got the cornet, I all but stopped playing flugel. Kanstul customer service is outstanding. My Kanstul trumpet and flugel were involved in an accident, I sent them back to the factory and wound up having a few conversations with the owner of the company in regards to repair and finishes.
To give equal time to other manufacturers ... I tried comperable Bach and Getzen cornets while I was shopping for the instrument I purchased. Both were well made, had a decent to nice blow, felt good in the hand... just not to the same level as the Kanstul.

_________________
Earl
Kanstul ZKT 1500

The superior man develops in harmonious proportions, his moral, intellectual and physical nature. - Jerrold

[ This Message was edited by: bophead on 2003-09-23 09:31 ]

[jamesfrmphilly]

"For some reason, and this is worthy of note, many of us find that playing a properly set-up cornet is less taxing to the chops and the body"

OK, now you got me interested!

i play a Bach 5V which is a deep V cup and a large throat, am i playing a cornet mpc with a trumpet shank?

i sometime wonder if the sound of early Miles Davis on his martin, where he seldom if ever hit a high note is actually a cornet style being played on a trumpet?

and what about bore size? i sometimes see cornets with quite large bores and i wonder if the traditional cornet is supposed to be larger than a trumpet?

I'd like to practice long hours as i have a lot of material i want to work through and if a cornet would be less tiring, that would be a great help.
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1946 Martin Committee, Bach 5V

[nieuwguyski]

Fuzzyjon,

A mix of both cylindrical and conical tubing, similar to the trumpet. The tubing has to be cylindrical through the valve section. Cornets and trumpets use the same mutes, so the bell flares are similar. The cornet mouthpiece receiver is quite a bit smaller than a trumpet receiver, so the leadpipe venturi is smaller. This results in a cornet leadpipe being somewhat more conical than a trumpet leadpipe.
_________________
J. Notso Nieuwguyski

[trumpetmike]

I would say a lot depends on which cornet you are using.
I have found that the long model Bach cornets react in a very similar manner to their trumpets. If you want to project like a trumpet, it is possible.
I use a Yamaha Maestro, even when I push it, it will remain a cornet sound.
If I was after a cornet to use in a jazz setting, I wouldn't touch my Maestro, but for the UK brass band, it is fantastic.
I have tried a number of older cornets, but very few of them cut it in a modern brass band. Some sound fantastic, some can cope with the volume now needed, but very few do both.
Maestro, Sovereign, Prestige - for the UK brass band, these are stunning.

[Tom K.]

James, it's interesting you mention Miles and the cornet because in his autobiography he mentions wanting to have a cornet sound. Why he didn't actually play the cornet is another matter. It probably didn't look right for him. He definitely was concerned with looks, how HE looked and how he looked with a trumpet. He was a fashion maven/monster/mogul.

The cornet is essentially conical and the trumpet essentially cylindrical.

[OldKid]

I play both Cornet and trumpet and I find it easier to play certain articulations and lip slurs with my Cornet. The Cornet has a broader more complex sound where as the trumpet is a cleaner sharper sound. I play the same size mp on each horn so the sound difference is because of the instrument and not the mp.
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YAMAHA Zeno B1C
Bach 181 Strad Cornet B1C
King (early 50's) Super 20 B1.5C

[ This Message was edited by: OldKid on 2003-09-26 10:10 ]