Memorizing Music

jhatpro · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 10:29 am Post subject:

Anyone have suggestions for the best, quickest way to memorize melodies and chord changes?
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

fuzzyjon79 · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 11:47 am Post subject:

hmmmm... I've always had a photographic memory... never had any problems with music memorization. I am familiar with keyboarding... so that has helped my ears quite a bit.
_________________
J. Fowler
"It takes a big ole' sack of flour, to make a big ole' pan of biscuits!"

jhatpro · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 11:59 am Post subject:

It must be a pain making all those trips to the drugstore to have your head developed.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

plp · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 1:37 pm Post subject:

I would divide whatever I had to memorize up into passages, and just woodshed the tough parts first as individual segments. Once I had those under my belt, I would tie the whole thing together start to finish. That way if I flubbed anything, I could always get back on track when I got to one of the tuffies. As the tastee bros. say, if you don't act like it was a clam, chances are no one will notice.... 'course that kinda goes out the window if you happen to be the only trumpet......just keep working it over and over, I don't think there are any shortcuts.

valvepimp · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 1:50 pm Post subject:

The best way to memorize a piece is to play it as often as possible. Even a very difficult piece will eventually become ingrained in you if it is repeated often enough. Sometimes difficult pieces are even easier to memorize, because you'll have to pay extra attention to passages requiring difficult fingering or which are played very rapidly. A bandleader in Junior High School, in order to prove a point, had the entire band put away the music to a piece we had been working on for several months. Then he had the band play it without music, and lo and behold it sounded as it always had. All the musicians had memorized their parts without even realizing they had. In my own experience I am not sure if I ever deliberately set out to memorize a piece, I rather just tried to learn it, and memorization was usually a side benefit.
_________________

PJN · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:05 pm Post subject:

Here is an idea,

I got this from Metaphors for the Musician, a jazz theory book by Randy Halberstad, a really effective teacher.

He uses the sequencer, (his term) just take the first measure of a four bar phrase, and work that measure , then add a measure, chew on those for a bit. then take measure three, work on that, then work measure four. Put three and four together, put the first two with the second two. Vamp on all four . Repeat with the next phrase, then connect. you actually concentrate your attention on smaller bites for less repetitions, chew them well and then glue them together.

Also, look for all the clues that help you find your way, chord function, chord repetition, large intervals, diatonic phrases, the FORM of the tune....

Hope this helps some...
_________________
The most important factor in developing the high register is desire, the patience to wait, and the necessary time to acquire it.
Bud Brisbois

BeboppinFool · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:23 pm Post subject:

I start at the end and work backward toward the beginning. Maybe I'll play the last 8 bars until I have them down. Then I'll play the last 16 bars until I have them down. And so forth.

That way, when I do play the piece all the way through it becomes more and more familiar as I go, rather than more and more uncertain.

My teacher, Dr. Donald S. Reinhardt always maintained that thinking the exact opposite of what is commonly taught is often the best way to learn and succeed . . . especially on a brass instrument.

My uncle once observed that a standard AABA 32-bar tune, it makes sense to practice the B section three times as much as the A section, because the A section occurs three times as often as the B section. In other words, playing the tune down once, you've already heard the A section three times as much as the B section. He speculated that this is why so many musicians forget bridges to tunes. I think he was onto something.

Lotsa little tricks . . . I'm looking forward to reading more.

Rich
_________________
Puttin’ On The Ritz

jhatpro · Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2003 10:20 pm Post subject:

Good ideas, guys.

For more, here's an interesting link:

http://www.telusplanet.net/public/jsloan/mem1.htm

Jim Hatfield/Chicago Area
"When Gregor Samsa awoke one morning from uneasy dreams he found himself transformed in his bed into a giant trumpet."

[ This Message was edited by: jhatpro on 2003-10-12 01:21 ]

[ This Message was edited by: jhatpro on 2003-10-12 01:22 ]

adieste · Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2003 10:46 am Post subject:

Rich,

Interesting idea of your uncle's. I think he nailed it...makes perfect sense to me. Time for me to start crossing bridges a lot more often!

Al
_________________
Trumpet: 1975 Benge CG, 1964 Martin Committee
Flugelhorn: 1963 and 1973 Olds L-12
Cornet: 1895 Conn Wonder, 1915 Buescher 57C
Pocket Trumpet: Funky No-Name Thing
Alto Sax: 1965 Buescher Aristocrat
Tenor Sax: 1956 Buffet Crampon Paris

musiclifeline · Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2003 11:33 am Post subject:

I think it was Claude Gordon who had the idea of practicing a tune backwards (i.e., the way BeBoppin Fool described it above) but either one beat or one bar at a time starting from the end and adding the bar/beat before it.

I like to learn jazz solos this way as well as work on etudes, etc. I generally take it a bar at a time.

I also sing things this way before I even pick up my horn to start learning it. That way I can practice it even when I'm away from the horn.

[ This Message was edited by: musiclifeline on 2003-10-16 14:34 ]

BeboppinFool · Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2003 11:41 am Post subject:

musiclifeline · Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2003 11:58 am Post subject:

I wish I could remember the name of the procedure that he used... it was kind of cool, but I guess not particularly memorable (to me). Indeed a brilliant idea, and indeed developed independently by many people.

jhatpro · Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2003 2:47 pm Post subject:

Patrick,

Thanks for the tip on the 'Metaphors' book! I just received it and it's filled with great insights.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

PJN · Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2003 6:24 pm Post subject:

Jim,

Glad you are finding it useful. I had the pleasure of taking a week of music theory from Randy at the Bud Shank Jazz workshop this summer. He is an excellent teacher! Lots of what we covered will keep me busy for a long time, but I love the way his "Cosmic" helps explain chord function and stuff like tritone subs. Again, a bit ahead of my ability right now, but he explained it so I could understand it!

Right on for your Quote of the day!

Patrick
_________________
The most important factor in developing the high register is desire, the patience to wait, and the necessary time to acquire it.
Bud Brisbois

mark936 · Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 3:49 pm Post subject:

re: CG/Boppin's method....

and then play it eight times without making a mistake. And then add another measure or phrase to the existing memorized one and play it eight times flawlessly. If you make any flub whatsoever you gotta start the count over.

That's what I remember.

jazztrpt · Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 10:21 pm Post subject:

If you need to memorize changes, think about how the bass notes are in relation to each other. Example: You want to learn Cherokee in C on Bb trumpet. The first several measures are all C. Then you go up a fourth to F. Then you stay on F, but just change it to Fmin7. Back to C for two bars. Then up one step to D. Up another step to E and two-five it out (E-A-D-G). Once you get to the bridge, go up a minor third for the two chord in C#(which is Ebmin7). The bridge is just two-fives in keys descending by whole steps. First key is C# (so...Ebmin7 Ab7 C#maj7). Next one is B. Next is A. Last is G, then two-five back into C for the final A section. Yikes! I think I made it sound harder...but seriously, if you think about it as bass notes, that lays the foundation. Just work on chord qualities then and drill it with scales and arpeggios. Memorization is all about repetition!

JohnnyChemo · Regular Member Joined: 11 Apr 2002 Posts: 49

cperret · Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 9:12 am Post subject:

I'd like to add that I'm a big advocate of mental practicing. Try to imagine playing the phrase you're trying to learn, and force yourself to stay still - don't move your chops or your fingers.

This has several advantages: By eliminating the physical aspect of playing the phrase, you can often memorize more material in a shorter time, and you may actually find that previously difficult passages are now easy. You shed some of the mental barriers like "whoa, this is too high" so you can focus on absorbing the material. You can stop and start where you want and practice at any tempo. Finally, you can conserve chops for more practicing!

I find that most of the time, when I'm having trouble learning a phrase, I realize that my mind really doesn't know it yet. By spending some focused time 'mentally practicing', things seem to lock into place for me. Hope this helps.

robert_white · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Feb 2003 Posts: 1583

You might check out David Baker's "How to Learn Tunes". It's an Aebersold volume, but I can't remember which one!

Anyway, it's a really good overview of common harmonic devices and ways to learn melodies quickly in a manner that is conducive to memorization.

Bob

jhatpro · Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2003 3:33 am Post subject:

Thanks for all the good advice, folks. It's starting to pay off!
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle