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Recording sound really awful


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mpsjazz
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Joined: 30 Apr 2019
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Location: Costa Blanca, Spain

PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 1:24 am    Post subject: Re: Recording sound really awful Reply with quote

EmYaNo wrote:
Is it normal that in real life, my sound is clear and full, but if recorded (iPhone SE) it sounds false and forced; kinda like beginner although I�ve been playing for 6 years. And there are many people that have told me I play very nice, others than family too, so it�s hard to believe that I actually sound that bad.
Any advice?


I've come to this thread very late, but I've been reading it with interest. So, EmYaNo, If you still read it sometimes, please take heart. You are not alone, and no, I don't believe that the main problem is your playing.

Listening to our recordings can be a good way to analyse mistakes and correct them, but a badly made recording can be extremely misleading. When I know that I am going to play in a recording (live or in a studio) I always try to play extra smoothly. This is because (1) the recording might miss some of my sound or even shorten my notes (2) People listen differently to a recording than they do to a live gig. That risky note or dirty tone you employed might be the icing on the cake at say a friendly jazz gig, but on a recording it gets more irritating every time you listen to it.

iPhones and cheap recorders made before now could seldom do any justice to a band, let alone a trumpet - which is probably the most difficult instrument to amplify and record. What other instrument can hit a microphone at up to 140dbl? It is no wonder that while recording the earliest jazz bands the engineers placed the trumpets at the back of the studio, and sometimes they still had to be muted.

Some members here have recommended the old Tascam DR-05 audio recorder and I have one of those, but usually the results are disappointing. The recordings near always sound cold and flat. Maybe it's OK for recording directly from a mixing desk, but I've had better results with the products that Zoom has made recently. The latest smartphones can do a surprisingly good job sometimes, but only if the acoustics are favourable and the positioning is correct. The latest audio recorders are less temperamental, but if the acoustics are bad, you may still need to record from the PA speakers or the mixing desk.

So, if a PA system, is employed at a gig, then it's safest to put eveyone through it, at least a bit, particularly if you are recording the gig. The PA is not just for volume, but for cohesion and good distribution of sound. I am learning that I need to use a microphone more consistently when gigging, particularly where there are poor acoustics, even if the trumpet is already "loud enough". So I'll drop my real volume instead of stepping back from the mic!

And I've decided to use a dedicated mic in future. No more doubling up on my supercardiod vocal microphone, playing into it from weird angles to darken and soften the trumpet sound. On some gigs there isn't even room for a second mic stand, so I'll get a side bar for one of the mics. There are some specialist vocal mics which are particularly bad for trumpet. If I don't know or trust the mic which is offered, I shall use my own mic from now on. I need to buy a better one actually.

I hope that relating my experiences helps somebody here.
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Lionel
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Joined: 25 Jul 2016
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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robert P has got it right.

"You need better gear", he said.

I had searched the while wide world over and still hadn't found a good one until I went in for some studio work back in '14.

And the engineer kept hovering all over us the brass section. Because he'd spent $2500 each on the mikes. And at least in this case the money spent was well worth it.
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Robert P
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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2019 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lionel wrote:
And the engineer kept hovering all over us the brass section. Because he'd spent $2500 each on the mikes. And at least in this case the money spent was well worth it.

And a mic doesn't even have to have a big price tag to get decent results, you just need to get to a point above built-in phone mics.

All horns and backing vocals (not the solo singer) on this were recorded with the same sub-$50 mic (on sale) going through a mic pre I got on sale for $75.

https://soundcloud.com/brassplyer-1/believe-remastered/s-CkLpA
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blackshady
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Joined: 18 Sep 2019
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As for myself, I believe it is very important to keep recording my own playing so that I can fix any little errors.
I normally record the practices on the computer so that I can maintain the high quality of the recordings. About the recorder, I use Joyoshare Audio Recorder.
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Lionel
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Definitely the equipment. Every trumpet player should probably be equipped with a truly good microphone. Plus a decent mixer, graphic equalizer, and superior P/A with recording equipment.

I used to buy a cheap condenser and insert inside my cheap microphone. This reduced the energy coming from the source (namely my tone) enough so that I wasn't sending a signal too great for the impedance of the mike. You take an ordinary sound wave they kinda resembles this squiggly thing

Here ~.

However if the mike is too sensitive and/or you blow too loudly or too CLOSE to the microphone??

Then the recording doesn't pick up the full wave and instead of the full, groovy wavelength the recording picks up only the "sides" of the wave,

like this: //// or maybe more this /\/\/\/\. Remember when grandma took pictures at Thanksgiving but cut the top off of Dad's head? Same thing* with the over blown sound wave.

Your recorded tone will not sound natural with the top of the wave cut off because it's not the natural tone. In fact the pitches will more resemble a vacuum cleaner roaring than the beautiful trumpet.

Try playing softer and/or with the mike a little further away. So your tone doesn't over blow the impedance.

Or buy something like "Yamaha Silent Brass". Perhaps there exist cheaper alternatives. It'll record far better than most ordinary P/A systems and won't wake up the neighbors.

I've often thought of using Silent Brass in concert with a small amplifier. With the mute on and an "On/Off" foot pedal? I could just nail tricky entrances in church or classical music.

Let's say there's a pianissimo A natural above the staff and I haven't blown a note for over 600 bars. That's just a pretty damned HARD thing to do. Almost impossible to play quietly enough without cracking the note. Yet with the system turned off to the P/A I can blow the thing a half dozen or more times well in advance of the entrance. Just to find exactly where it sits on my cold chops.
Audience can't hear it because the P/A is off. Only during the actual execution of the tone will the people hear it.

Is this cheating? Maybe. But the music is made by you and not overdubbed.
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