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shofarguy
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 Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| trumpet.trader wrote: | | TKSop wrote: | | Richard III wrote: |
HA! I knew Arturo would be the obvious choice. But he sounds great on anything and can adjust his sound to sound like anything he wants. Thanks guys for all the suggestions. |
Sure... But Arturo's the kind of guy that could endorse almost whatever he chooses - if he says he wants to endorse a horn, almost any maker will do their best to accommodate him.
So... Odds are, he's playing one because he feels that it's the best fit for him - he must feel either enamored with the sound, or the playing sensation (or both) or he wouldn't be using it.
Most serious pro's could play most quality trumpets and most quality mouthpieces around their size - the reason they choose what they do is either sound or its that they feel most comfortable and get the most consistent results with what they've chosen... I doubt it's about money for the vast majority of endorsements |
I found 4 or 5 vids on YouTube, not really looking, but found vids of Arturo playing MANY different horns from different manufacturers.
And on each he says wow, what an amazing horn, best I ever played etc
Arturo, Im sure is just trying to be nice and respectful. And Im sure he gets offered endorsements from different trumpet builders all the time and offered free horns all the time. Although he is a classy guy, has the resources and probably offers to pay for the horns.
Recently Ive seen him play his Wild Thing. And Ive also seen him play about a half dozen other manufacturers horns on live shows
I assume he covers up the logo on his horns with cigar wraps for some endorsement contract reasons? Or maybe just trying to avoid controversy? But hes been doing it since he stopped played his Leblanc signature horn 15 years ago or so.
I dont know anything for sure, except Arturo is a gear head. And thats awesome. And I bet hes glad to help all the trumpet manufacturers anyway he can. |
Flip can say for sure, but I think Arturo wraps the cigar label around his trumpet bells in honor of his dear friends the Fuente family. Carlo was in many photos on FB with Arturo until his recent death.
The rest of what you say is very true. Arturo is the focus of many different brass horn makers. To my knowledge he is not under any endorsement contracts. I know he has never been in any such arrangement with Flip, other than that they became and remain close friends after Nate Mills arranged for him to meet Flip in San Diego back in 2005 (?) when Flip introduced Arturo to his instrument line.
I asked Flip about Arturo playing his instruments, once. He said, "Arturo is a great artist. He can play whatever instruments he wants. He just happens to like the Wild Thing."
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Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds. |
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Don Herman rev2
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, he has layed many different horns.
He paid for his WT, including the gold plating and very cool engraving.
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Flip Oakes
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Mnc
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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I realize this is a Wild Thing thread but as an amateur comeback player, ( Community Band, Community Theater, and Big Band ), and having owned two Bachs, ( 37/25 and 72/25 ), I found a Celebration solved the higher range stuffiness problems along with a much phatter mid and low range. Would like to hear from other Celebration players as well.
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Rapier232
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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My Wild Thing has developed an annoying habit. The second valve hangs up on its up stroke. It comes up slowly, but only sometimes. And only if held down for a longer note. Seems to be towards the end of a show. No amount of cleaning or trying different oils makes any difference. A matinee and an evening show today and then a break fortunately, will give me a chance to sort it out hopefully.
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shofarguy
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| Rapier232 wrote: | | My Wild Thing has developed an annoying habit. The second valve hangs up on its up stroke. It comes up slowly, but only sometimes. And only if held down for a longer note. Seems to be towards the end of a show. No amount of cleaning or trying different oils makes any difference. A matinee and an evening show today and then a break fortunately, will give me a chance to sort it out hopefully. |
I can think of two things:
First, did the 2nd valve tube loop get pressed into the valve block? I've heard that this can deform the 2nd valve casing enough to bind the piston.
Second, How old is your WT? What you describe is what happened to my Benge 5X. Especially, what you say about holding the valve down before releasing it, the various valve oils, etc. In my case, the first valve was just worn out. Zig Kanstul showed me how the piston moved side-to-side in its casing. I had them replate and refit the whole set of three. They did such a good job!
Alas, Kanstul is not doing repair work, as this time. Not usually, at least.
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Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds. |
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trumpet.trader
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| Rapier232 wrote: | | My Wild Thing has developed an annoying habit. The second valve hangs up on its up stroke. It comes up slowly, but only sometimes. And only if held down for a longer note. Seems to be towards the end of a show. No amount of cleaning or trying different oils makes any difference. A matinee and an evening show today and then a break fortunately, will give me a chance to sort it out hopefully. |
As mentioned a very common issue with a sticky 2nd valve has to do with the second valve slide.
Sometimes the 2nd valve slide has gotten a little askew from either a bump, or pressure from being in a case or gig bag. And the entire slide may have been pushed in towards the valve block. Even just a very little of this can cause the valve to hang up because the is pressure now on the valve block squeezing against the piston.
A quick fix is to ever so gently put a little pressure while pulling the entire second valve slide out and away from the horn. Usually a couple light brief tugs can relieve the pressure on the valve casing and free up the piston.
If youre not comfortable trying this, by all means see a repair tech but Ive seen this be a very common issue and very simple solution we can try ourselves before spending money at a shop. |
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INTJ
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| shofarguy wrote: | | This is a repost of a video I shot for the Experience thread. Here, I am playing my Wild Thing flugelhorn. |
Thanks for posting the link. Very interesting how the different leadpipe material affectes the sound.
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shofarguy
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| INTJ wrote: | | shofarguy wrote: | | This is a repost of a video I shot for the Experience thread. Here, I am playing my Wild Thing flugelhorn. |
Thanks for posting the link. Very interesting how the different leadpipe material affectes the sound. |
It's more the feeling than the sound. Nickel parts make the horn a little more stiff in its response. It does add a little brilliance to the sound, but not a lot. The player may be able to tell if both are played side-by-side, but I don't think an audience would ever be able to.
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Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds. |
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trumpet.trader
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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I played a couple Benge trumpets with very close serial numbers. Both 1971-ish 3X but one had all nickel slides.
The one with nickel slides was so insanely bright! Im sure it could have been due to other factors, but I think the slides really made the difference. |
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Brad361
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Rapier232 wrote: | | My Wild Thing has developed an annoying habit. The second valve hangs up on its up stroke. It comes up slowly, but only sometimes. And only if held down for a longer note. Seems to be towards the end of a show. No amount of cleaning or trying different oils makes any difference. A matinee and an evening show today and then a break fortunately, will give me a chance to sort it out hopefully. |
Have you tried contacting Flip? An intermittent valve problem like that would drive me NUTS.
Brad
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When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
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INTJ
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Mnc wrote: | | I realize this is a Wild Thing thread but as an amateur comeback player, ( Community Band, Community Theater, and Big Band ), and having owned two Bachs, ( 37/25 and 72/25 ), I found a Celebration solved the higher range stuffiness problems along with a much phatter mid and low range. Would like to hear from other Celebration players as well. |
I think the only difference between the WT and Celebration is the bell flare so I would expect it to have a similar open blow. I am curious as to the difference in sound between a WT and Celebration.
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Brad361
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| INTJ wrote: | | Mnc wrote: | | I realize this is a Wild Thing thread but as an amateur comeback player, ( Community Band, Community Theater, and Big Band ), and having owned two Bachs, ( 37/25 and 72/25 ), I found a Celebration solved the higher range stuffiness problems along with a much phatter mid and low range. Would like to hear from other Celebration players as well. |
I think the only difference between the WT and Celebration is the bell flare so I would expect it to have a similar open blow. I am curious as to the difference in sound between a WT and Celebration. |
I briefly (should have kept it!!) owned a Celebration. My take on it was that its very similar in openness to the WT, but the sound seemed a bit more focused, think firehose (Celebration) vs water cannon (WT). As far as tone color, MAYBE a bit brighter (I used the same mouthpiece on both, in the same band). The bell on the Celebration was obviously smaller at the flare, which might (?) account for the more focused projection.
Other than that, I didnt perceive much difference, Flip may have a different opinion on the two.
Brad
_________________
When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval
Last edited by Brad361 on Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:31 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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1957Tim
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Location: Hannibal Missouri
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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I remember Flip saying that the bells are totally different between these two models. The Celebration has a bell very similar to a Bach 72 model, which is why Bach players feel so comfortable with this horn right out of the box. One of our fellow TH members, Tom Turner, owns and plays four different Flip Oakes horns, with these two being a part of that group, so maybe he will weigh on this for us. 
-1957Tim |
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chuck in ny
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| Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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thanks for the 2nd valve slide tip lads i have been unaware on this issue.
it is always possible for a trumpet to get bumped on this protrusion without the need to blame and get overly upset. what we are talking about inside the casing has to be a thousandth or two. taking it into the shop many techs are very fair with pricing. |
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CJceltics33
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| Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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If the above suggestions dont work for the 2nd valve, do this:
Thoroughly clean your horn and valves
Switch to a different oil( I recommend La Tromba)
Wipe your valves with a rag before each time you oil
I had the same issue, and after I did the above, my valves work fine. |
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Rapier232
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Joined: 16 Aug 2011
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Location: Twixt the Moor and the Sea, UK
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:36 am Post subject: |
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| CJceltics33 wrote: | If the above suggestions dont work for the 2nd valve, do this:
Thoroughly clean your horn and valves
Switch to a different oil( I recommend La Tromba)
Wipe your valves with a rag before each time you oil
I had the same issue, and after I did the above, my valves work fine. |
Tried that first.
Ive lost faith in it now, so have just bought a nearly new Smith-Watkins for $3150 dollars, a saving of $1400 on a new one. Will be selling the WT.
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"Nearly as good as I need to be. Not nearly as good as I want to be".
Smith-Watkins Bb
Will Spencer Bb
Eclipse Flugel
Smith Watkins K2 Cornet
JP152 C Trumpet
Besson Bugle |
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Don Herman rev2
'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2005
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Location: Monument, CO
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:05 am Post subject: |
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Probably could have had a bigger savings by sending it to Flip to check out... I damaged my WT many years ago (busy stage, playing and running sound, foot caught a mic cord and it dragged my WT down and bounced it along the floor, pretty smashed up) and after Flip fixed it you could not tell it had been damaged. He turned it around very quickly as it was a busy time, even though I told him I had my backup Bach, and I can't remember the charge -- very minimal if any, he was nearly as crushed as I was.
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trumpet.trader
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:34 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Rapier232"] | CJceltics33 wrote: |
Ive lost faith in it now, so have just bought a nearly new Smith-Watkins for $3150 dollars, a saving of $1400 on a new one. Will be selling the WT. |
Those are fun horns. Ive only played 2 different models and owned one for maybe a year or so. I am a bit of a gear head and the interchangeable leadpipes frustrated me because I couldnt be satisfied and was always switching. Drove myself crazy!
I ended up trading that horn for a flugelhorn as I recall, and its on the top of my list of horns I wish I never let go of.
The ones I had played were at least fitted with Kanstul valves. Not sure how much of the rest of the horn was Kanstul.
Any insight on the current or newer Smith-Watkins and Kanstul parts?
Thanks and enjoy the new (ish) horn! |
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Brad361
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Location: Houston, TX.
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:35 am Post subject: |
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| Don Herman rev2 wrote: | | Probably could have had a bigger savings by sending it to Flip to check out... I damaged my WT many years ago (busy stage, playing and running sound, foot caught a mic cord and it dragged my WT down and bounced it along the floor, pretty smashed up) and after Flip fixed it you could not tell it had been damaged. He turned it around very quickly as it was a busy time, even though I told him I had my backup Bach, and I can't remember the charge -- very minimal if any, he was nearly as crushed as I was. |
Yep.
I STUPIDLY dropped a valve on a bathroom tile floor (***clink clink clink ***😫) while cleaning my WT, REALLY screwed it up, could not even thread the valve stem back on. Sent the horn to Doctor Valve, not very expensive, good as new.
Brad
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When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
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