Silver Plating and Long Term Tarnish Effects

[jazzvuu]

I have mainly silver plated horns (Yamahas) that do get a colorful tarnish over time of sitting on my shelf (particular the less frequently used one such as a flugelhorn, Eb/D, and piccolo). I have a polishing cloth I used from time to time when I have the urge to shine them back up. My question is if I let the horn stay tarnish and not remove the tarnish, are there any effects on the plating over the time. I know that polishing removes the bits of silver over time.

[LittleRusty]

I might get some anti-tarnish bags to store them in, even if you decide to not polish on an occasional basis.

[Crazy Finn]

I never polish my horns. I've never seen any issues with the plating as a result of this - other than they are mostly pewter colored.
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LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn

[jazzvuu]

[Brassnose]

I know of someone who likes silver plate but wants it to stay clean so he had the whole horn plated and then laquered. Seems to work.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

[cgaiii]

When you polish or use a polishing cloth you remove silver in the form of silver sulfide. The tarnish is silver sulfide. The more tarnished a horn is when you polish it the more you remove. On good horns this is not really a problem unless you are polishing every day. On some cheap horns you can eventually polish the silver away. When I bought my Mack Brass bass trumpet, I was warned not to polish it too much.
Leaving the tarnish on does not remove any silver. From that point of view, it might be better than polishing if you do not mind the look.
Another alternative is disassembling the horn and putting it in a very hot bath on a piece of aluminum foil with baking soda in the water. This will cause the sulfur atoms to migrate to the foil (except where oils cover them) and give you a beautiful horn with no loss of silver. I have never done this with trumpets, but I have done with a bugle with stunning results. You would definitely only want to do the body of the horn with valves out. Thorough washing afterwards.
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Bb: Schilke X3L AS SP, Yamaha YTR-6335S
C: Schilke CXL, Kanstul 1510-2
Picc: Kanstul 920
Bb Bugle: Kanstul
Bb Pocket: Manchester Brass
Flugel: Taylor Standard
Bass Trumpet: BAC Custom
Natural Tr: Custom Haas replica by Nikolai Mänttäri Morales

[Brassnose]

You can actually do this in a dishwasher: wrap the disassembled horn in aluminum foil and start washing. Tried it once. Make sure to take the felts etc out.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

[cgaiii]

[adagiotrumpet]

Some polishing cloths are mildly abrasive. They work, but by being abrasive, they are removing silver to some degree. I have used Hagerty's which I don't believe is abrasive. The only issue with the Hagerty's is the spray can constantly clogs up, which can be a pain. Years ago I also use to use Twinkle silver polish which I don't think is abrasive either. Both seem to work well.

[HaveTrumpetWillTravel]

[quote="jazzvuu"My question is if I let the horn stay tarnish and not remove the tarnish, are there any effects on the plating over the time. I know that polishing removes the bits of silver over time.[/quote]

I have heard both opinions. Some folk obviously let their instruments tarnish. That said, I do have two horns that I bought used. One had deep tarnish on the bell that seemed to have eaten through the silver on one section of the bell (it at first looked like pitting and I was able to remove it but I can see that that section now tarnishes faster and the plating looks thinner. I have another trumpet I think is nickel-silver with pretty extensive pitting.

I don't know why sometimes an instrument will just tarnish and other times it develops pitting. Does anyone know?

[JayKosta]

Some silver polish products are intended for 'solid silver' items, such as 'sterling silver' forks and spoons. That type of silver item has the silver content throughout the entire piece. So the polish can be more abrasive because the silver layer is not just a 'top coat'.

Most 'silver' trumpets are plated on the outside surface with a thin layer of silver. An abrasive polish (or too much polishing) can wear through the layer of silver and expose the underlying metal - usually brass.
Look for polishes that are expressly for 'silver plate' items.
And STOP when the appearance is 'good enough' - don't keep trying to polish to mirror finish.
A polishing cloth for 'silver plate' should be adequate for most situations. After it is used (it will get blackish), keep it in a zip-lock plastic bag. It will continue to work fine for a long time, when it falls apart from use, then get another.

Rubber bands can quickly tarnish silver - so don't use them on the instrument. I wouldn't keep any in the case either.

Jay
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.

[adagiotrumpet]

[Crazy Finn]

[jazzvuu]

I been using cloth elastic hair bands for valve ties for a while now. It great but confuse students because i have 1/2 inch long hair. :p

I have done the aluminum, baking soda, and vinegar process for removing tarnish and it works great but the horn smell for a while of the process.

[LittleRusty]

[Croquethed]

I bought a small jar of Twinkle 3-4 years ago because I could not find the 3M stuff locally. I tried the baking soda method a couple times, but it did not appear to provide any preventive properties so I have stopped the fun with chemistry exercises.

I've used the polish no more than twice a year, more usually it gets one home polish between its annual trips to Osmun, where Jim Becker returns it gleaming new.

If you leave the horn out on a stand it will tarnish more quickly. I put mine back in the case nearly every night, but I am not worried about rubbing the plating off with one or two applications a year.

[HaveTrumpetWillTravel]

I visited a trumpet store last week and they had a "old new stock" (I think that's right)/display instrument that was showing deep tarnishing including what looked like the beginning of pitting (very dark spots amidst the tarnish).

I'm kind of reiterating my question above: Is there a danger of causing serious pitting if you never polish your silver trumpet?

Here's my guess: it depends some on environment. I live in a high humidity environment and I seem to see more red rot and also more silver pitting. But maybe in most places it's not a concern....

[rockford]

The advice I received last year from Anderson Plating was to never use silver polish and use a polishing cloth. Apparently using polish etches the surface. One year into this latest silverplate job the trumpet still looks new. I just use a bath towel to wipe it down after use.
_________________
Bill Siegfried
NY/Mt. Vernon Bach trumpets. Yamaha flugelhorn and piccolo A/Bb, Monette and Hammond mouthpieces. Fender and Peavey Cirrus Bass Guitars. Ampeg and Genz-Benz amps. Embraer 170/175/190.

[Crazy Finn]