Piccolo Trumpet Help

[Krafty934]

Hi guys,
I'm a sophomore in high school and am wondering whether or not I should get a piccolo trumpet. The only trumpet I have is still my first beginner trumpet from 6 yrs. ago. The reason I want to get a piccolo trumpet is because I heard some songs played on the piccolo trumpet and I thought that the tone quality and sound were really good. Do you guys think that I should buy one, and if so, what's a good one for under $2000? Thanks for the advice!

Kaushik

[DSanchee]

I'd suggest getting a C trumpet before you get a pic, you will find that a C trumpet will be used more.

Derek

[Nonsense Eliminator]

Here is how I would prioritize my trumpet spending if I were you:

1.) Good teacher.
2.) Good B flat trumpet.
3+.) Whatever said teacher thinks is appropriate.

At the risk of sounding insulting, if you're asking this question in this venue, chances are you're not ready for a piccolo trumpet.

[_Don Herman]

I tend to agree with the others, that upgrading your Bb is probably first. Getting that nice sound on the wee beastie is challenging at best (and hopeless at worst -- depends on what kind of day I'm -- and it -- are having! ) The picc is quite a bit tougher to play than your Bb, and takes slightly different mindset. (OK, I'm not sure about the "slightly" part.)

FWIWFM - Don
_________________
Don Herman/Monument, CO
"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music." - Aldous Huxley

[1B]

Definitely start with a good teacher. Then get a good Bb. I use my piccolo 3-5 times a year on gigs. I use my Bb and C every week. Realize that the picc will not extend your range. Range on picc and Bb are comparable for most people. Also, the picc has a lot of back pressure, and will wear you out. I have some outstanding high school students, and they get a C after the Bb. I tell them to wait for college before they invest in a picc.
1B

[_PhilPicc]

I agree with all of the above.

If you do not have a private teacher you should get as good of one as possible. Whoever you get will be able to evaluate your situation better than I can. It takes a very mature embouchure to play the picc.

Hearing a Wynton or a Maurice play picc and doing it yourself are usually two entire different equations.

I think there are other elements that need to be addressed before you start playing picc.
_________________
Philip Satterthwaite

We cannot expect you to be with us all the time, but perhaps you could be good enough to keep in touch now and again."
- Sir Thomas Beecham to a musician during a rehearsal

[Schilkeguy]

I got a picc before I got a C, but I did get a Schilke B5 before I got a picc. Whether or not you should get a picc depends on what you play. If you are good at transposing but want to do wedding gigs, maybe a picc would be better. Things to remember when playing picc: If you don't use the air, you sound like a goose. It isn't pretty. use the air, always. It isn't an instand octave, it's just a trumpet that has the overtones muved up an octave so the c in the staff and g above the staff are just one slot apart (then g to c, c to e, e to g ect...). It's a whole different animal. You deffinately need a teacher if you're going to attempt it. I did and do have a teacher. As for the good picc for the money, look for used. Go try out some new ones if you can get to a good store. My suggestions would be a Stomvi, yamaha, Selmer Paris (what I have), and, if you have about $2400 to burn, a Schilke. Good luck man, go for a good Bb horn first, though.
_________________
Trumpets: Schilke B5, Schilke CX4L, Old style Selmer Paris Picc
Mouthpieces: GR65L, 65**** lead, B&S 7E picc
Age: 18

[AverageJoe]

Since you are a sophomore in High School, I recommend getting a good teacher first, and then after you ask your teacher about getting a piccolo, I think there is a 99%+ chance that he/she will have you upgrade your Bb first.

Just reinforcing the mass opinion here...

Paul Poovey

[brad333]

I bought a picc when I graduated from high school. They're absolute devils to play and I really don't use it that much. You would be much better spend your money on a big horn that you use more often, Bb or C, or flugel if you play jazz at all.

That being said. There's no way to learn picco other than playing one and it's hard to play one a lot if you don't buy one. Consider renting one if you're curious because you only play the things for concertos, weddings, and limited quintet and orchestra work. You won't be using it in the concert band at school for higher stuff because it'll be unnecessary and will just sound weird.

Get a good teacher who'll help you choose a good Bb trumpet. You teacher will show you so many things to work on with just a Bb trumpet you won't have time for piccolo. But if you are really really interested try renting one first.

_________________
Yamaha 6335HII(Bb)
Yamaha 6445HSII(C)
Yamaha 6810s(picc)
Courtois 154(flugel)
Olds Ambassador Cornet
GR 65.6M/FL

[ This Message was edited by: brad333 on 2004-01-09 15:57 ]

[samlg]

ive been borrowing a picc over xmas mainly because of the same reasons as you. but now i have had it for a while i realsied i wasnt ready for it. i could play most of the brandenburg on my Bb before id played a picc but it wasnt a whole lot better to start with. it is great fun to play, and theres some good stuff to play on it. i would say get a better Bb, a new horn will make you play more just for novelty value and that will improve your playing. an Eb/D might be more handy as you can play some of the same stuff and a whole host more.

have fun, sam

[Mr. Stomvi]

There isn't a reputable teacher alive that would recommend that you get a picc or even a C, Eb etc. at you present age. There simply is way, way, way too much to study on the big Bb horn that needs to be covered first before you start working on the picc. Around my area most good college trumpet profs. wont even start their college students on the picc until their junior or senior year or maybe even grad school. Think of the picc as a completely different instrument which requires a different sound concept, different fingering, different articulation, different musical style that needs to be learned, transposition skills, not to mention range and murderous intonation problems. Almost every second that you would be putting into practice on the picc would be taking you away from the important basic practice time on the big horn. I would also be willing to bet that 99 % of most piccs that are purchased are rarely if ever played after they are purchased. They are just that hard to play. Piccs are one (if not the most) difficult instruments to play out of all instruments. Most people purchase them after listening to great recordings (Maurice Andre in my case) and think - "I ought to be able to do that". What a shock (and ego deflation) it is the first time you try to play one. At the moment I practice picc about 2 -3 hours a day. 2 hours/day on basic skills (fingering exercises for 4th valve use, scales, lip slurs, etc.) and 1 hour/day for literature.

Words of advice

1. Get a teacher pronto
2. Practice basic skills - scales, fingering exercises, flexibility studies, sight reading, etc.
3. Purchase lots of good trumpet recordings - many different styles.
4. Purchase lots of Maurice Andre and also Hakan Hardenberger CDs to provide you with lots of inspiration and keep the fire burning.

The trumpet is a very hard instrument and takes lots of hard work and tons of patience.

Good luck on your journey

Seth Moore
_________________
"He has Van Gogh's ear for music."

Billy Wilder

[trumpetmike]

I hate joining the ranks of THers discouraging you from the piccolo course of action, but I feel I must.

As people have already said - you need to find yourself a decent teacher (if you have aspirations towards eventually playing piccolo, a teacher who actually plays one of these instruments regularly is even more important). They will be best placed to advise you upon further instruments, or whether you are in need of a better Bb.

The order I got my instruments were Bb, Bb cornet, Eb/D, piccolo, C - mainly due to the necessities of the playing I was doing at each stage. I played Brandenburg a couple of times before obtaining a piccolo. For both I borrowed one. I was doing more orchestral work (youth orchestra) and we were doing a number of pieces on D trumpets.

The C trumpet is not nearly as commonplace here in the UK, I have only really started using it in the past few years.

If you do (in discussion) decide that a piccolo would be a good instrument for you, you need to play them to see which works for you. I spend a lot of my time playing piccolo, have played a huge number of them and have found that almost never do two players agree on which is the best. We trumpet players have enough trouble deciding which Bb trumpets are worth playing, piccolo is even more down to individual tastes, in my view. I play in a symphonic brass ensemble which carries two piccolo players (of which I am one). We are both good piccolo players (we are told) on our own instruments, but if we exchange instruments - we sound awful!

[Krafty934]

Thanks a lot for the advice guys. I've been trying to find an excellent teacher in my area that can also help me with jazz as opposed to only symphonic and orchestral. I'm thinking about getting a new Bb trumpet. Leaning towards a Schilke or a Wild Thing (my other post). Thanks a lot so far. You guys give the best advice!!

Kaushik

[OCTA-C]

I agree with everyone. I picked up a yama picc (6810) a long while back literally dirt cheap and had some fun with it. Luckily, thanks to all the great posts on TH, I picked up the concept and technique of playing the picc fairly quick (but not great), even though I cheated and used my left index for the fourth valve. And even used it for two weddings. Anyway, even after all this I still did not get all the playing time and satisfaction out of it that I did with my C trumpet. I ended up selling the picc for the new C and have put some cash away for another picc down the road or maybe even a D/Eb that I have found fairly useful (I have been borowing my friend's Yamaha).

IMO, what equipment I feel is most important, after a good teacher of course is:
1.) a good and comfortable Bb
2.) a comfortable mouthpiece that matches you and the horn.
3.) either a C or a flugel ( depending again on what type of music you play or will be playing)

P.S. I tend to lean slightly towards the flugel. You can use it for just about anything.

Just my opinion!
_________________
Jay S.

"May the good sound be yours!"

"Always remember to blow into the proper end of the horn!"-circa. 1900 (Harry Gardoon)