Bach Commercial or 43B bell on 180 Strad?

[Brassnose]

My Bach (signature) has (again ) developed some red rot in the leadpipe in spite of me cleaning and drying. It’ll hold up for a few years but will need some replacement in the future.

While at it, I have been thinking about a further mod on the bell. The 43GH bell is great in its own right but I am a rather dark player (or so it seems from band recordings) and so the idea is to replace the 43GH bell with a 43B (Mariachi) or a 1B (Commercial) bell to add some zip.

Any thoughts?

I like the horn otherwise (been playing it since 1992) but the next leadpipe will certainly not be a Bach leadpipe anymore anyway, so I may as well do some other stuff with the horn.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

[chef8489]

That's pretty unusual. How far apart was it for the red rot? Was it raw brass? Are you drinking high sugary drinks and acidic drinks and not brushing teeth before playing?
I think Bach made a 44 pipe that was nickle silver. Wynton used it.
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Current horns
2023 Bach 19072G/43 pipe with 1st trigger
1966 H.N. White King Silver Flair
1965 H.N. White King Super 20 Sllversonic Symphony 1st trigger

[Irving]

A standard 43 brass bell will be a lot brighter than a 43 GH. The other bellls that you mention might be too bright. Plus they are specialty bells not offered on a standard Bach.

Unusual that you got red rot. Did you dry out the leadpipe after each playing session? I had Dick Akright of Best Music, San Franciso make me a nickel silver leadpipe, and it has remained free of red Rot. Don't think that he is still working there though.

Bach does make a 44 leadpipe. That will add to brighten the trumpet.

[zaferis]

Yeah, sometimes red-rot just happens. I've had many Bachs without issue, but have one in my kit now that is showing signs of rot in the leadpipe.

My first choice would be to replace the leadpipe with the exact same one - a Bach. I've swapped leadpipes on a couple horns with not the original - loved it at first, but ultimately preferred the original.

Then if you are going for a new choice:
Bach 19037 !!! these ARE 180's on steroids-if you like 18037s you'll love this one.
Bach Commercial - a great horn if you love how Bach's play & you're looking for a lighter more commercial sound.
43 - for me the lesser of the 3.
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Freelance Performer/Educator
Adjunct Professor
Bach Trumpet Endorsing Artist
Retired Air Force Bandsman

[Brassnose]

Ok, trying to answer all the questions I don’t typically drink sugary stuff at all, just water and brush my teeth before playing, unless I am at a gig long before stage time. Same goes for food.

After playing I dry the horn and leave it in the open with at least the tuning slide out; typically also the valve slides come out.

The horn is lacquered and the leadpipe was replaced five years ago.

The weird thing is that the previous leadpipe (stock 25) held up for 25 years with a much more abusive treatment (bought the horn when young and didn’t take good care of it). In spite of this, the now 5 years old “new” leadpipe has red spots that look worse than any of the spots I had on the old leadpipe (and before anyone asks, the overhaul has been done by a premier German trumpet builder).

When the time comes I’ll talk to Martin Böhme who does custom Bach overhauls and fits his own leadpipes. I already had the chance to playtest a Böhme/Bach - was the first 37 I liked, good horn.

Alternatively I have already been looking at the 44 leadpipe - I generally like nickel silver and play a Lotus 3S-N and also like the Hüttl Silver Colibri with a nickel silver bell and similar horns.

Replacing the 43GH with a 43* is an option - I was just curious if anyone had gone further and added one of the other bells I asked about.

Oh, and about replacing the Bach. Possible, but I don’t like to accumulate horns. There are a few models I have been thinking about but am pushing this a little into the future. I’d like to see how the current problem evolves first.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

[OldSchoolEuph]

The 1B and Mariachi bronze bells are tweaked to work on 190 series horns, so such a swap would be unwise - better to just fix up (or not) and sell to raise funds for one of those horns. Admittedly, the 43GH is an oddball, and a standard or * 43 bell would probably be more to your liking and improve the value of the horn.

As for the pipe, if they keep rotting out on you, sorry to say, it's probably you - nothing you can do about that. The solution is to go to MK for a leadpipe that matches well to the bell and body, but is not yellow brass.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20

[Brassnose]

Yeah, well, the leadpipe annoys me but can certainly be fixed. I’d probably not order something from overseas such as M/K as we have good trumpet builders here as well but I get your drift.

And whatever happens my next leadpipe is certainly going to be gold brass, nickel silver, or even sterling silver - food for thought.

I do generally like the the 43GH bell but it is probably not the best solution for soul, funk, and big band stuff if you need to cut against all those electrified folks.

On the more economic side of things I have been looking at a Carol Brass with nickel silver leadpipe, tuning slide, valve slides, and a lightweight yellow brass bell, but as I said earlier I’ll hold off for a little bit and see what I will do with the current horn.
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Frate, Klier

[Brent]

I think looking at a Carol is a great idea. They're comparable to horns that cost twice their price.
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Brent