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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 7:07 am Post subject: Schilke vs Yamaha |
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Hi guys,
In terms of ease of play and brightness, which do you prefer, Schilke or Yamaha.
I was looking specifically at the 8310ZSII/8335LASII vs the B series 4,5,6,7 and the X3.
Thanks!
Ken
Last edited by Kennyg2019 on Mon May 09, 2022 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total |
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OldSchoolEuph Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2012 Posts: 2441
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 9:51 am Post subject: |
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What is "easier" for one player is "harder" for another. Depends what characteristics make it easier for you. _________________ Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com
2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20 |
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Brad361 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 7080 Location: Houston, TX.
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 10:48 am Post subject: |
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OldSchoolEuph wrote: | What is "easier" for one player is "harder" for another. Depends what characteristics make it easier for you. |
This. ☝️
Brad _________________ When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
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kehaulani Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9028 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 10:50 am Post subject: |
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Your post of 8310OZSII needs one less zero. I searched it as is and got a Russian sex toy. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn
Last edited by kehaulani on Mon May 09, 2022 11:45 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 11:07 am Post subject: |
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Ooops! Sorry about that!
Thanks, guys. And thanks to all of you who have PM'd me with your experiences with these trumpets! 👍🏻 |
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p76 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jun 2006 Posts: 1070 Location: The Golden City of OZ
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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Depends on what you mean by "ease of play" - if you mean an open blow, the Yam LA is great, as is the B5. If you mean "efficient" then go the Shew horn.
In my limited experience of the horns you mention, the Yamaha LA would be the one I'd pick - it's a really really good trumpet, which is not to downplay the others on your list.
Cheers,
Roger _________________ Bb - Selmer Radial, Yamaha YTR634, Kanstul 1001, Kanstul 700.
C - Yamaha 641.
Cornet - Olds Ambassador A6T, Besson 723, Olds Ambassador Long.
Flugel - Kanstul 1525
Mpc. - ACB 3CS, ACB 3ES, Curry 3BBC, Kanstul FB Flugel |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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p76 wrote: | Depends on what you mean by "ease of play" - if you mean an open blow, the Yam LA is great, as is the B5. If you mean "efficient" then go the Shew horn.
In my limited experience of the horns you mention, the Yamaha LA would be the one I'd pick - it's a really really good trumpet, which is not to downplay the others on your list.
Cheers,
Roger |
Hi Roger,
I guess by ease of play I mean an open blow...but not so open that I don't have enough air to play it. Plus, I also mean good slotting, intonation, etc...so that I don't feel like I'm constantly struggling to "hit the bullseye". I'm a comeback player so I need all the help I can get!
BTW, I just ordered the LA and the OZ. Whichever horn I like better, I will order the closest Schilke...perhaps the X3 or the B5/B6...and compare them.
Thanks for your help!
Ken |
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p76 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jun 2006 Posts: 1070 Location: The Golden City of OZ
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Ken,
No worries - by all means if you can buy them all!! (maybe you could come down under and explain to my wife why that is always the best option )
I'd be very interested to hear your verdict on the horns once you've had some time with them.
I really wanted to like the Shew horn, but I just found it stuffy. I owned a YTR732 some time ago, which was a precursor to the Shew line - M bore. It was the most beautiful sounding trumpet I've ever had, but again, I just found it backing up on me all the time - which says more about my playing skill than the horn.
The LAs I've tried have all been really good horns - similar in blow to my YTR634 and Chicago 1001, but with more zip to the sound.
The B5 is a good horn, but I didn't really get a lot of time on the one I tried - again, be interested to know how it compares to the LA.
Have fun with it all!
Cheers,
Roger _________________ Bb - Selmer Radial, Yamaha YTR634, Kanstul 1001, Kanstul 700.
C - Yamaha 641.
Cornet - Olds Ambassador A6T, Besson 723, Olds Ambassador Long.
Flugel - Kanstul 1525
Mpc. - ACB 3CS, ACB 3ES, Curry 3BBC, Kanstul FB Flugel |
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cgaiii Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Jun 2017 Posts: 1548 Location: Virginia USA
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Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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OldSchoolEuph wrote: | What is "easier" for one player is "harder" for another. Depends what characteristics make it easier for you. |
Totally agree with this statement, but here is my experience with the two brands.
I own a Yamaha YTR-6335S (my backup horn) and previously played a YTR-4335S. My Schilke is an X3L with the Sandoval modifications.
The X3L was "my" horn the first time I picked it up -- plays easily and evenly in all registers, will play to the extent I can play. It is fairly open and free blowing. It is not particularly gap sensitive and I play it on a Bach 1.5C with a 26 throat.
I had to work a lot harder to get the YTR-6335S to play like I like it (more like the Schilke, I guess). I worked on the gap with Jim New's gap modulator and discovered how gap sensitive it is. Had it pretty good, but then I got an Austic Custom brass mouthpiece (with an acrylic top for cold weather) and found it a little better, playing more to my liking. Got their 1.25C to go with the symphonic backbore and now the horn plays really nicely. I do not mind switching. Though the 6335 is supposed to be a more free playing Yamaha, I found it a little tight at first.
I modified both horns by replacing the nylon valve guides with metal valve guides.
I still prefer the Bach mouthpiece on the Schilke and the ACB mouthpiece on the Yamaha, but with those combinations, switching horns is easy. (I chose the 1.25 C for the ACB mouthpiece because the softer rim makes it feel smaller. This way they feel about the same size.
Purely an individual experience. _________________ Bb: Schilke X3L AS SP, Yamaha YTR-6335S
C: Schilke CXL, Kanstul 1510-2
Picc: Kanstul 920
Bb Bugle: Kanstul
Bb Pocket: Manchester Brass
Flugel: Taylor Standard
Bass Trumpet: BAC Custom
Natural Tr: Custom Haas replica by Nikolai Mänttäri Morales |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 2041 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 1:35 am Post subject: |
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It's hard to answer that question across an entire line of trumpets. I'd say that the most popular Schilke models generally lean in the direction of brighter and more open-blowing than the most popular Yamaha models.
But compare a Schilke B4 and an X4, or the Yamaha Shew and Chicago models, and you'll see big differences within those respective lines.
And compare a Schilke B2 with a Yamaha 8335 and you might not find a big difference.
The specific models themselves are what matter most. Try as many as you can to find what works for you. |
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Yamahaguy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2004 Posts: 3992
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 6:39 am Post subject: |
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FWIW, I definitely preferred the Yamaha EM model and Schilke B5...both are extremely mouthpiece
backbore sensitive though, as most horns are I guess. |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 8:47 am Post subject: |
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Follow up question:
Which bell produces a brighter sound, Yellow Brass or Beryllium?
Thanks. |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 8:55 am Post subject: |
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p76 wrote: | Hi Ken,
No worries - by all means if you can buy them all!! (maybe you could come down under and explain to my wife why that is always the best option )
I'd be very interested to hear your verdict on the horns once you've had some time with them....
Have fun with it all!
Cheers,
Roger |
Thanks, Roger. I will let you know what I think of them all!
Currently, I only own one trumpet, so I have a long way to go to catch up with you! |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 2041 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 9:07 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | Which bell produces a brighter sound, Yellow Brass or Beryllium? |
In my limited experience, the SCHILKE "beryllium" bells are brighter than yellow brass bells. That may be at least as much related to thickness -- Schilke "beryllium" bells are quite thin -- as to the material. |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 9:17 am Post subject: |
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Thanks, Dayton!
Would you happen to know if there is any difference in responsiveness? |
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Dayton Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2013 Posts: 2041 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 10:06 am Post subject: |
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If there was a difference in responsiveness it wasn't significant -- at least not significant enough for me to remember (in contrast with the brightness, which was noteworthy, especially when played louder and higher). |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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Ok...Thanks! |
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dershem Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 1887 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Tue May 10, 2022 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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OldSchoolEuph wrote: | What is "easier" for one player is "harder" for another. Depends what characteristics make it easier for you. |
+100 _________________ BKA! Mic Gillette was my mentor and friend.
Marcinkiewicz Mic G. trumpet, Custom Marcinkiewicz mpc. (Among others)
Marcinkiewicz Rembrandt flugel, Benge 8Z cornet, King 2B, Bach 36, Benge 190, Getzen 3062... many more. All Marc. mouthpieces. |
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Kennyg2019 Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2022 Posts: 261 Location: NY
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Posted: Wed May 11, 2022 8:43 am Post subject: |
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Just found a great deal on a demo B3! I hear it's similar to the X3 with a smaller bell and not quite as open. I wanted a Beryllium bell but I think Yellow Brass will be good enough...especially since that's all I've ever played!
The Bergeron arrives tomorrow so this should be interesting! |
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Christian K. Peters Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Nov 2001 Posts: 1531 Location: Eugene, Oregon
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Posted: Wed May 11, 2022 9:04 am Post subject: Yamaha vs Schilke |
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Kenny,
Yes, the only difference in the X3 and B3 are the bells. I think that I have read that the throats of the bells are the same, just that the taper from tail to throat is obviously different. I have also been told that the B3/X3 maybe the lightest of the series, as the tubing wall thickness is the thinnest. Expect the B3 to have less core/middle-low overtones, even with the yellow brass bell. For future reference, a Beryllium #3 bell maybe even brighter in timbre, or a special made copper #3 bell could add back in some of the middle overtones/core sound. You might have to have that conversation with Fred Cantu form the FB Schilke Enthusiast forum. _________________ Christian K. Peters
Schilke Loyalist since 1976 |
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