Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 11:08 am Post subject: What defines a good lead trumpet (gear)
Hi,
I am wandering what makes a great lead trumpet, particularly I have been thinking that my Lawler C7 could be considered a good trumpet for playing lead.
What do you think?
Do any of the committee owners (or committee copies) play lead regularly on said trumpets?
Woody Herman had an all-Committee section back in the dark ages. To the best of my knowledge, neither he nor anyone else did that since. There's a reason. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Joined: 24 Feb 2008 Posts: 2642 Location: vista ca
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 12:54 pm Post subject:
If the c7 is like a committee it should be pretty good.
Bill chase is playing a committed in the British video which is amazingly good.
The video of mikes doing new rumba on tv has Ernie royal sound super human on a committee. Double D at the end like just pushing a button.
Pete candoli played a lot of committee.
Al Hirt got an amazing lead sound on honey in the horn which is great display of trumpet sound and ability.
Mic Gillette played big committee
It’s a pretty long list
There is no reason not to have a section full of committees _________________ Mouthpiece Maker
vintage Trumpet design enthusiast
www.meeuwsenmouthpieces.com www.youtube.com/lipshurt
Concerning the Martin Committee: I remember gathering four trumpets together in a room with a friend. I had my Wild Thing, my Schilke X4, a Burbank 6X-CG and a Kanstul 1603.
Of those four, the Schilke had the most aggressive sound by some margin. I would choose that horn for a big band or stage band setting where I need to dominate a section. The Burbank CG was the easiest to play in the upper range, but didn't have the weight in its sound or the impact of the X4.
My Wild Thing seemed to have the most run-of-the-mill sound in that room, from the perspective of a commercial lead trumpet. The 1603 just didn't have near the same level of projection, in comparison.
Later, I had the chance to directly compare the 1603 with a real large bore Martin. They were as identical in sound character as two different trumpets could be, IMO. So, I don't expect that a Committee would have significantly better projection than the Kanstul version. I know a lot of trumpets that would just bury a Committee in a section.
My personal favorite lead trumpet sound is what I heard from Rob Sack's 1963 Schilke B3 Beryllium. It was made back when that term meant something. Rob could get that baby to sing so sweetly in the upper register with such good cut and presence.
Today, I think I would also look at the Bach Commercial with the #1 bell. I played an ML version briefly and liked it a lot. _________________ Brian A. Douglas
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper
There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.
I am wandering what makes a great lead trumpet, particularly I have been thinking that my Lawler C7 could be considered a good trumpet for playing lead.
A good lead trumpet is a horn that allows you to play lead trumpet parts well (taking into account ability), and gives you the sound and projection you need (situational).
If you are really comfortable on your C7 and getting good control over sound and articulation there is no reason why it couldn't work well as your lead horn, particularly if you match it up with an appropriate mouthpiece.
Edit: From my perspective, the bottom line is to choose the gear that makes it EASIEST for you to play what you need to play -- right sound, articulation, etc. There are players who could sound fine playing lead parts on a Holton 602 student trumpet with a bored-out 1B mouthpiece. Realistically, that's probably not the set up that would make it easiest to get the job done. If you have a choice, go with what is easiest to play best on. That may be the C7, or could be something else. Again, mouthpiece probably matters more than horn.
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 2164 Location: Little Elm, TX
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 3:35 pm Post subject:
There are so many variables and I've heard good lead played on all kinds of horns--large bore, medium large, medium, big bell, small bell, lightweight, heavyweight, etc.
I've known and played with good lead players who played on everything from Holton MF horn to Yamaha Z to Claude Gordon Selmer to King Silver Flair to bog-standard Bach Strads.
When I was playing lead I used a Getzen Eterna Severinsen (now available as the Eterna Classic). I could cut through the band very easily with it.
Bore size doesn't always mean bigger sound. I play-tested some Holton MF Horns that just didn't do it for me--they were surprisingly stuffy with my setup.
What Dayton said about the mouthpiece is probably more important. _________________ Bryan Fields
----------------
1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1977 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
1995 UMI Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces
Joined: 23 Mar 2003 Posts: 9041 Location: Hawai`i - Texas
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 6:14 pm Post subject:
Joe, I think I noticed you added the word "gear" to the thread title. I don't know your background, so please put this in perspective. The reason I started off with Jimmy Maxwell's book wasn't flippant, but is that, unless you know specifically where you're going, you won't know the best way to get there.
And I repeat. Committees may have been used by some notable lead players but that doesn't negate that if you rook a thorough survey of what equipment today's main lead plauers are using, you will fund a dearth pf Committees. _________________ "If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Thanks for sharing that record, Mike! What a treat with Ernie on lead and Clark sneaking in a wonderful obbligato! And Teri Thornton's vocal is a knockout! I needed that right now. _________________ 1919 King Liberty
1923 Conn 22B
1955 Selmer 24A (Balanced Action)
1981 LA Benge ML #3 bell
1938 Couesnon Flugel
1907 HN White Co. "King" Cornet
1977 Selmer Picc
Joined: 06 Feb 2002 Posts: 2349 Location: Santa Cruz County, CA
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:00 am Post subject:
Around 10 years ago John Capobianco sat in with a big band I was playing lead in. John played lead on his vintage medium-bore Committee on several tunes and I took the opportunity to walk to the back of the (big) room to listen to the band. John sounded great and had no problem asserting himself over a band that tended to play loud. _________________ J. Notso Nieuwguyski
Joined: 28 Nov 2008 Posts: 1020 Location: Southern CA
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:38 pm Post subject: Re: What defines a good lead trumpet (gear)
jairo_saade wrote:
... I am wandering what makes a great lead trumpet ...
What do you think?
It depends completely on the player.
Some guys (Arturo Sandoval for instance) prefer large bore horns - like the .470 Wild Thing. Other guys (Bobby Shew for instance) prefer much smaller horns - like a .450 bore Yamaha. Wayne Bergeron uses a .460 bore Yamaha.
These, IMHO, are among the best "lead" trumpet players in the world - and the horns they prefer couldn't be any more different from one another.
So the bottom line - while maybe not particularly helpful - a "great" lead trumpet is the one that works best for you. _________________ Bill Blackwell
Founder - Sons of Thunder Big Band Machine
Joined: 13 Apr 2004 Posts: 992 Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:50 pm Post subject:
I think a good lead horn should be balanced with the mouthpiece you use for lead. The mouthpiece is the most important factor, and which is primarily determined by your physiology. Then you find a horn with the appropriate resistance and sound. _________________ "I'm 73 and I'm still learning." - Maurice Murphy
Joined: 31 Dec 2015 Posts: 900 Location: Bay Area, California
Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:47 am Post subject:
Every horn responds differently when played loud and/or high. There's a spectrum of sound. Typically for lead, you want a horn that brings out the higher, "sizzle" frequencies when pushed. A horn that retains a dense, dark sound at higher volumes and range will not lend itself to lead playing in big band and Latin playing. In my experience, the tone quality of dark, open horns is not optimized with shallow mouthpieces.
That's one factor, but the other important factor is using a horn that works for the way you play, that you enjoy playing and feel comfortable on.
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