Student Trumpet versus Professional

[acerimele]

What is the big picture difference between a student trumpet and a professional trumpet. I would think overall quality, sound and price.

If a student, say with 3 years experience, were to play on a professional model would that hamper their ability to grow and refine their skill versus student.

Any feed back would be great.

[Crazy Finn]

[stuartissimo]

[shofarguy]

The biggest difference is price point. Parents generally need something that allows their child to explore without a big financial risk to the parents. They want something that will survive their child's treatment of the thing. Beyond that, it's the very same game as professional grade instruments. It all depends on who is building them.
_________________
Brian A. Douglas

Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper


There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.

[Dayton]

I regard price as the primary factor and durability as the second. Manufacturers need to be able to make student horns inexpensive enough for the parents of 4-6 graders to be willing to give them a try, and good enough to encourage the child to stick with the horn and be ready for, and interested in, a professional model by high school age. Quality and parts availability also need to be good enough for the music store that rents out the student trumpets to be able to keep them in good repair.

This...breaks down...with manufacturers that don't make professional-quality instruments. They focus on making their student-level trumpets as inexpensively as they reasonably can, not worrying about things like durability, repairability or someone wanting to step-up to the next level horn under that brand name.

[Tom LeCompte]

I would arguie that student trumpets are intended to hit a certain price point, which means ease of manufacture, as far as consistent with that, they are intended to be robust so that the little dears don't destroy them quickly, and as far as consistent with those two goals, they are intended for ease of sound production, sacrificing flexibility and tonal coloration if necessary.

I've mentioned in other messages I have a Yamaha 2335. It plays well enough that nobody complains, but it is definitely more work to play. Like many student horns, it blows a little tight. Above the staff it is like parallel parking a garbage truck. The pitch is quite good, which is a good thing, since if you deviate from the horn's pitch center it will put up a fight.

It is very, very good for what it is. But the gap between it and my "least good good horn", a Burbank 5*, is bigger than the gap between any of my good horns.

That said, the "intermediate" 4335 and 5335 are really, really excellent. I can see a pro preferring them to a "pro" horn, especially if he is looking for a tighter horn.

[hackney_wick]

[Tom LeCompte]

Never played a 3-series.

[NickF]

[huntman10]

So, my contention is that we are talking as if the choice is binary, or perhaps a 3 option rating or of student, intermediate, and pro. Maybe divided along price point and build quality. I first want to add the classification of TSO's (trumpet shaped objects, and I disclaim inventing the term, as I learned it years ago on TH.) For purposes of controlling the scope of my discussion I would like not to consider novelty instruments or odd key trumpets.

I would group TSO's as poorly designed, constructed, or made of inferior or improper materials. Another problem seen in TSO'S would be flimsy construction, or instruments that are not repairable. Unfortunately, as previously covered by Crazy Finn, many people, simply using price point, assign TSO's to the student trumpet pile, while we need to be aware that they are not appropriate for beginners. Student trumpets should be robust and repairable, so as not to frustrate students (and parents). Also, I feel that student level trumpets should not be too "edgy" or brilliant to insure better tone and easy to blend.

On the other hand, "professional level" trumpets have much tighter tolerances that can make them inappropriate for kids, if a little dirt makes it into the wrong places, or a slight impact on the 3rd slide locks the valve. Also, a lot of pro level horns have lighter, thinner bells and slides. Just imagine the New York Strad I saw after a year in the 5th grade band!
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huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc.

[Bill Blackwell]

When Kanstul was in business, I had it on good authority that the student model 700 was made under the same quality controls (such as they were) and standards as their professional models (which in some cases retailed for thousands of dollars more). The 700 had a two-piece bell, which differed very little from their 900 "intermediate" model, which had a one-piece bell. The 900 compared to some of their professional horns was only badging - and pricing.

When Olds was producing instruments, the only thing that separated the professional horns from their student model (the Ambassador) was water keys and bracing (and, of course, price).

The answer to your second question is, therefore, obvious.
_________________
Bill Blackwell
Founder - Sons of Thunder Big Band Machine

Wild Thing Bb - Copper
Wild Thing Flugelhorn - Copper
Wild Thing Short-Model Cornet - Copper

The future ain't what it used to be. ...
- Yogi Berra

[spitvalve]

Nick Drozdoff plays a Getzen 490 student model as his daily driver and he loves it. He owns other more professional model trumpets but prefers the 490 for most of his work.

To invoke a cliche, it's the archer more than the arrow.
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Bryan Fields
----------------
1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1977 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
1995 UMI Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces

[stuartissimo]

[Bill Blackwell]

[NickF]

[Man Of Constant Sorrow]

Nick ~

Are you a politician ?
_________________
Sub-Optimal Hillbilly Jazz

[shofarguy]

[Jimbosan]

[quote="Bill Blackwell"][quote="stuartissimo"]... O
I should have been more specific. I was referring specifically to the Olds Mendez model, which was essentially a "beefed-up" Ambassador.

I thought the Mendez was essentially a "beefed-up" F. Besson/Benge?
_________________
Kanstul FBClassic bflat&C
'42 Buescher205
'45 Committee
'47 Holton48
'47 Conn22b
'48 Benge
'69 Olds Custom Crafted
'78 Getzen Eterna
'64 Bach Strad Cornet
'62 Olds Spl Cornet
'64 Conn 80a
'54 Conn 34a
Benge flugel
Olds,DEG Bugles

[Jimbosan]

Agree with others that you should use Yamaha, Jupliter, or Getzern as a baseline for "student" trumpets. If your child starts with one of those, it will be many years before the horn holds them back. The trumpet would still be good enough to use for marching band practice. Save the Zenos and Strads for concerts and lessons. "Pro" trumpets are designed to produce a particular tone, slotting, resistance, look, efficiency, to fit the feel you want and type of music you are going to use it for. Some are more versitile in that regard than others. You would expect the quality to be better at the prices you will be paying. You probably won't know what kind of "Pro" trumpet you really want until you are an advanced player. That's probably why a Bach Strad 37 is the most common first choice.
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Kanstul FBClassic bflat&C
'42 Buescher205
'45 Committee
'47 Holton48
'47 Conn22b
'48 Benge
'69 Olds Custom Crafted
'78 Getzen Eterna
'64 Bach Strad Cornet
'62 Olds Spl Cornet
'64 Conn 80a
'54 Conn 34a
Benge flugel
Olds,DEG Bugles

[OldSchoolEuph]