Historical instruments: "Trompettes à 6 pistons"

[Ludger.S]

Hi everyone,

I will soon be playing Saint-Saëns' "La Déluge" in a historical performance practice setting. The original edition parts on IMSLP ask for a "Trompettes à 6 pistons". Anybody got an idea what could be meant by a 6-valve trumpet in the 1870s?

My understanding is that by that time the age of experimentation was over and our modern three valve design already well established. It is also completely possible that Saint-Saëns simply did not know what he was asking for.

In the end I will mainly have to decide between playing it on a low-F or a Bb instrument. But it would be lovely to know what they were actually working with.

Grateful for any small bit of information!
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Berlin-based freelancer
Interests: baroque trumpet, solo literature, pedagogy

[Brassnose]

Ask Jake, he is probably able to help you:

https://www.berlinertuba.com/

(Say hello from Andreas and tell him I still have his 1950s Blessing trumpet case )
_________________
2019 Martin Schmidt eXcellence
1992 Bach 43GH/43
1989 Kühnl & Hoyer Model 15 flugel
1980/2023 Custom Blessing Scholastic C 😎
1977 Conn 6B
1951 Buescher 400 Lightweight
AR Resonance, Klier, (Frate or Curry)

[OldSchoolEuph]

Possibly referring to a double-piston valve configuration (though that was mostly 1840s-50s)?

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Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20

[Gabrieli]

I noticed on IMSLP that there are also parts for two 6-valved trombones apart from the 3 "normal" -presumably slide - trombones.
The 6 valve trombone was quite common in Belgian military bands into the 20th century.
The 6 valves are, I think, 1/2 tone, 1 tone, 1 1/2 tones, 2 tones, 2 1/2 tones and 3 whole tones as in the seven slide positions. I would guess that the six valve trumpets were the same system but I have never seen one.

Just use your 3 valve f trumpet and play well in tune

Looking at the whole score, I wonder if the f trumpets à 6 pistons are meant to sound a fifth lower than written, unlike the other 2 "normal" f trumpets.

Viel Glück

[Ludger.S]

@Brassnose: Thanks for the tip Andreas! I need to visit Jake anyway and ask him to restore my old Besson Meha.

@OldSchoolEuph: That's an interesting looking instrument. In terms of valve technology, it should be the trumpet equivalent of a Vienna Horn, right? I always wonder if trumpets with such a wide bell were meant for the orchestra or some kind of wind band.

@Gabrieli: Sounds like a very convincing theory to me. I found this cool video on a 6-valve trombone https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6mDDYnXASs.
I also wondered about the correct octave for those 6-valve trumpets. For that period, it seems very unusual to go that high. The recording I found interprets it the common way (up a fourth), but I am not 100% convinced by the result.
_________________
Berlin-based freelancer
Interests: baroque trumpet, solo literature, pedagogy

[OldSchoolEuph]