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cpt_trumpet_guy
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Joined: 05 Dec 2019
Posts: 10
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 Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:09 am Post subject: International delivery fail |
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I ordered a couple of mouthpieces from a popular custom brass workshop in the USA, I'm based in South Africa. Total value of $175.
Unfortunately it looks like the package made it to an airport in South Africa, but has gone missing since. Last tracking info is 28 Dec.
I mailed the company letting them know and the response, while friendly and professional, wasn't great. Basically they can put in an insurance claim but that's about it.
I'm not sure what to do next, do I just give up? Or do I put more pressure on the seller to send replacements? |
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kehaulani
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 9030
Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2023 8:45 am Post subject: |
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Find out whether the buyer or seller is responsible for submitting the insurance claim and proceed from there. But first check to see if you have missed the deadline for filing such claims.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
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ghelbig
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 May 2011
Posts: 908
Location: Reno, NV
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2023 9:12 pm Post subject: Re: International delivery fail |
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| cpt_trumpet_guy wrote: | I ordered a couple of mouthpieces from a popular custom brass workshop in the USA, I'm based in South Africa. Total value of $175.
Unfortunately it looks like the package made it to an airport in South Africa, but has gone missing since. Last tracking info is 28 Dec.
I mailed the company letting them know and the response, while friendly and professional, wasn't great. Basically they can put in an insurance claim but that's about it.
I'm not sure what to do next, do I just give up? Or do I put more pressure on the seller to send replacements? |
If it made it all the way from the USA to South Africa it doesn't seem likely that the package went missing because of something that the seller did wrong.
Why would you put pressure on the seller to send replacements?
What part of the shipment getting lost at an airport in South Africa is from a mistake that they made?
If it was insured, file a claim. If not, make sure that the next shipment is insured.
Gary. |
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cpt_trumpet_guy
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Joined: 05 Dec 2019
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:34 pm Post subject: Re: International delivery fail |
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| ghelbig wrote: |
If it made it all the way from the USA to South Africa it doesn't seem likely that the package went missing because of something that the seller did wrong.
Why would you put pressure on the seller to send replacements?
What part of the shipment getting lost at an airport in South Africa is from a mistake that they made?
If it was insured, file a claim. If not, make sure that the next shipment is insured.
Gary. |
In South Africa the responsibility of packages defaults to the seller, the seller is responsible until the buyer accepts it.
I asked here because I was genuinely looking for advice/input |
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delano
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Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 5:45 am Post subject: |
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| But the seller is not in South Africa. |
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cpt_trumpet_guy
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Joined: 05 Dec 2019
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:03 am Post subject: |
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| delano wrote: | | But the seller is not in South Africa. |
Which is why I came here to ask for advice on what my position should be |
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JayKosta
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3307
Location: Endwell NY USA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:12 am Post subject: |
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Request a refund of your purchase price from the seller, because you did not receive the items.
The seller might not want to send any more items to SA due to possibility of additional loses.
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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ghelbig
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 May 2011
Posts: 908
Location: Reno, NV
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| delano wrote: | | But the seller is not in South Africa. |
It looks like this is going to turn into a $175 geography lesson.
In the USA the seller's responsibility ends when the shipment is accepted by the carrier.
The seller is not obligated to give you a refund for errors outside of their control. I don't know why anyone would suggest that.
The seller is responsible for putting the right item, in the described condition, in the shipment and preparing the shipment properly. The carrier will inspect the address and packaging before accepting the shipment.
The seller is not responsible for the carrier's ability to get the package to the purchaser. That's what shipping insurance is for.
The seller should assist you with filing the insurance claim. There is no requirement that they do, but it is usually done as a customer service. (I've never had a seller that wouldn't co-operate. Except for Amazon.)
Gary.
PS: There are a number of countries that North American merchants will not ship to. Don't be surprised if your country gets added to a list. |
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chef8489
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Joined: 16 Aug 2011
Posts: 858
Location: Johnson City Tn
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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| ghelbig wrote: | | delano wrote: | | But the seller is not in South Africa. |
It looks like this is going to turn into a $175 geography lesson.
In the USA the seller's responsibility ends when the shipment is accepted by the carrier.
The seller is not obligated to give you a refund for errors outside of their control. I don't know why anyone would suggest that.
The seller is responsible for putting the right item, in the described condition, in the shipment and preparing the shipment properly. The carrier will inspect the address and packaging before accepting the shipment.
The seller is not responsible for the carrier's ability to get the package to the purchaser. That's what shipping insurance is for.
The seller should assist you with filing the insurance claim. There is no requirement that they do, but it is usually done as a customer service. (I've never had a seller that wouldn't co-operate. Except for Amazon.)
Gary.
PS: There are a number of countries that North American merchants will not ship to. Don't be surprised if your country gets added to a list. |
Depends what carrier. Many times ups requires the shipper to file the insurance claim and won't let the receiver do so. I have been in that situation and had to deal with the shipper to get reimbursed for the item while they filed the claim with ups as ups refused to allow me to file the claim as the recipient of the package.
_________________
Current horns
2023 Bach 19072G/43 pipe with 1st trigger
1966 H.N. White King Silver Flair
1965 H.N. White King Super 20 Sllversonic Symphony 1st trigger |
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Gottfried Reiche
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Joined: 27 Nov 2013
Posts: 184
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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| ghelbig wrote: | | delano wrote: | | But the seller is not in South Africa. |
It looks like this is going to turn into a $175 geography lesson.
In the USA the seller's responsibility ends when the shipment is accepted by the carrier.
The seller is not obligated to give you a refund for errors outside of their control. I don't know why anyone would suggest that.
The seller is responsible for putting the right item, in the described condition, in the shipment and preparing the shipment properly. The carrier will inspect the address and packaging before accepting the shipment.
The seller is not responsible for the carrier's ability to get the package to the purchaser. That's what shipping insurance is for.
The seller should assist you with filing the insurance claim. There is no requirement that they do, but it is usually done as a customer service. (I've never had a seller that wouldn't co-operate. Except for Amazon.)
Gary.
PS: There are a number of countries that North American merchants will not ship to. Don't be surprised if your country gets added to a list. |
This is really interesting, since the SELLER is the one that would be acquiring the insurance. The seller is literally "insuring" that the product will arrive. So if it doesn't, then it really SHOULD be up to the seller. I agree that in actuality it doesn't work that way, but I thought it was kinda funny. I can see both sides of it.
Good luck! International shipping is a pain! Hopefully it works out for you! If it's the seller that I'm thinking of, I hope their communication to you wasn't rude and dismissive! |
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LittleRusty
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 12664
Location: Gardena, Ca
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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First off, I am sorry for your loss. Good luck, I hope it wasn’t too expensive.
| ghelbig wrote: | | delano wrote: | | But the seller is not in South Africa. |
It looks like this is going to turn into a $175 geography lesson.
In the USA the seller's responsibility ends when the shipment is accepted by the carrier.
The seller is not obligated to give you a refund for errors outside of their control. I don't know why anyone would suggest that.
The seller is responsible for putting the right item, in the described condition, in the shipment and preparing the shipment properly. The carrier will inspect the address and packaging before accepting the shipment.
The seller is not responsible for the carrier's ability to get the package to the purchaser. That's what shipping insurance is for.
The seller should assist you with filing the insurance claim. There is no requirement that they do, but it is usually done as a customer service. (I've never had a seller that wouldn't co-operate. Except for Amazon.)
Gary.
PS: There are a number of countries that North American merchants will not ship to. Don't be surprised if your country gets added to a list. |
While I don’t dispute any of the statements written entirely from the USA perspective, if the seller knowingly shipped to a country with diametrically different laws, which one trumps the other?
I don’t know international law, but I suspect the USA laws don’t trump SA’s when the seller knowingly ships to another country. It certainly doesn’t when you ship something that is legal in the country of origin but not in the destination country.
But getting satisfaction over a few hundred dollars is unlikely. I suspect spitting the losses is the best to hope for. |
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delano
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| It’s a question of international private law. Every region (like USA, Europe) has its own sets of rules. On the subject of internet transactions this kind of disputes have to be controlled by international treaties. As a longtime retired lawyer (12 years now) this is too new for my aged knowledge. But the lawyers I know specialised in this field are all very rich. Maybe there is some international treaty where both the USA and SA are bound. Ask American customs about it. |
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kehaulani
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 9030
Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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| Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 8:52 am Post subject: |
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Is this a Custom's issue? Could be but I see nothing that would imply that. Check with the carrier, clarify who has to do what for a lost item. and go from there. Is there something I overlooked? 'Cause if I didn't, this is overkill.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn |
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LittleRusty
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 12664
Location: Gardena, Ca
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| Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | | Is this a Custom's issue? Could be but I see nothing that would imply that. Check with the carrier, clarify who has to do what for a lost item. and go from there. Is there something I overlooked? 'Cause if I didn't, this is overkill. |
I believe Delano was replying to my comment about whose laws take precedence in an international transaction. Specifically the US favors the seller and SA favors the buyer which are opposites so which takes precedence? |
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