Mouthpiece for Summon the Heroes

gtr1023 · Regular Member Joined: 07 Jan 2023 Posts: 22

Hey everyone!

I'm playing 1st part in Summon the Heroes later this year. I'm looking for a mouthpiece that has that orchestral sound but isn't taxing on the embouchure. I'm currently using my Bach 9, but that doesn't do very well in terms of endurance. I know the Summon the Heroes part is very tough in terms of endurance (high stuff)

What are your thoughts on mouthpiece choice?

Thanks!

abontrumpet · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 May 2009 Posts: 1783

EDIT: Since people aren't reading the entire thread: this advice was mistakenly written thinking the OP was playing a 9C, not a 9. Ignore it and follow the rest of the advice.

BAD ADVICE BELOW!
A mouthpiece switch will not be the answer for Summon the Heroes. There is nothing very different about it that would require a massive sound shift like playing lead in a jazz band/musical or something that requires a flugel like sound. Also, nothing really "specialty" about it. Those, broadly speaking, are the main reasons we switch mouthpieces up: for "sound" and for things that require something specific (like lead, piccolo trumpet, etc).

You could experiment to find a mouthpiece that works better for you that "has that orchestral sound but is LESS taxing on YOUR embouchure." But it likely wouldn't be too drastically different than your current piece and might actually be bigger.

Other than the obvious (get a teacher, work on developing a great sound with lots of listening to pros and recording your practice, keep the chops fresh, practice with intention, etc), it would be good to have another player playing the 1st part so you guys/gals can trade off and work with each other. Nothing more fun than tackling a part together!

Andy Cooper · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2023 7:09 am Post subject:

I looked at your profile and mouthpiece history - looks like you came from a Yamaha 5A4 - a Bach 9 is probably a lot harder for you in the upper register and while it is probably giving you a nice core sound it may not be giving you enough "sparkle".

Why not demo the Schilke 9C4 and perhaps the Yamaha 8C4. I know the Schilke 9C4 has nice clear trumpet sound. While it has a shallower cup than the Bach 9, it has a larger throat and backbore. If that's too much, try the Yamaha 8C4.

Normally I would say - practice - but in this case, the Bach 9 is probably just too deep for you.

abontrumpet · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 May 2009 Posts: 1783

wilder · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2023 8:34 am Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2023 8:50 am Post subject:

"Summon" is a hell of a blow. Good luck.

My understanding is that, generally, a wider rim with a broader, flat surface gives extra cushioning for better endurance. You might want to relate that to your "test" mouthpieces. Not saying that's your answer, just that you might want to throw that into the mix.
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Dayton · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2023 10:28 am Post subject:

Adam West · Veteran Member Joined: 02 Jul 2008 Posts: 416

Wow, that's some seriously bad advice all around. And cruel. Given the context of the question, I think you may be over-prioritizing "sound." Listen to Andy Cooper. A smaller mouthpiece is a totally reasonable thing here. Go to a shop and try some out. That's the only way. Yes, lessons may help too! As will proper practice (don't just play the solo over and over). But go find a mouthpiece that works better for you. No shame in that!

abontrumpet · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 May 2009 Posts: 1783

JayKosta · Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2023 1:40 pm Post subject:

First question is whether high C's are in your current 'public performance range'?

Can you currently really play them without excess rim pressure, and with a decent sound quality?

On a more basic level, is your current technique capable of doing real playing in the A - C range? Good solid notes on a reliable basis.

Are you trying to 'use less rim pressure' because of problems getting the notes to sound, or not being able to get air flow?
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Andy Cooper · Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2023 4:19 pm Post subject:

Just to clarify

The OP is coming from a Yamaha 5A4 with a successful range above high C and then went to a Bach 9 and is struggling.

Comparison of the Yamaha 5A4 and Bach 9
https://trumpet.cloud/mpc/index.html?mpc1id=VA913436&mpc2id=B005300

I'm suggesting that - perhaps the OP does not have a lot of lip intrusion into the mouthpiece and so the Bach 9 might just be too deep to get the needed brilliance in the sound. Putting an edge on the sound with the Bach 9 probably requires overblowing - overblowing leads to reduced endurance. (Happens with trumpet players who try to play cornet using a Denis Wick mouthpiece - they keep trying to put zing in the sound.)

One possibility is a change to a Schilke 9C - not a Bach 9C. The Bach 9C might work just fine - it's just that I have always admired the crisp, clear sound of the Schilke 9C. The Schilke is about the same diameter but smaller cup - it might make it easier to get " that orchestral sound" the OP wants.

Comparison of the Yamaha 5A4 and the Schilke 9C
https://trumpet.cloud/mpc/index.html?mpc1id=VA011300&mpc2id=VB913436

The Yamaha 9C4 is also a possibility - closer to the Bach 9C. These both have smaller throats and backbores than the Schilke.)

Switching from a Bach 9 to a Schilke 9C, Yamaha 9C4 or Bach 9C is not a switch to a smaller diameter mouthpiece - just a change in cup depth ( cup capacity).

If the OP did not already have a history of playing above high C, I would not suggest a mouthpiece change.

JHirakawa · Veteran Member Joined: 11 Mar 2022 Posts: 155

You can try a Bach 9b. It's easier to play in the upper range than the 9, and with the b cup, it still has a nice tone for such a small dia. Or you can try a Yamaha 8c4. It's has a slighly larger dia, with a brighter tone. I have all three mouthpieces.
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BudBix · Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 6:17 am Post subject:

I agree with the Bach 9 being too deep. I'd try a Yamaha 8C4 or Bach 10 1/2C.

olympicfan2 · New Member Joined: 20 Jan 2024 Posts: 4 Location: Germany

I leave aside my opinion about switching mouthpieces and just say that I use my Yamaha 16D for very much everything except piccolo trumpet stuff.

I play summon the heroes on the 16D in the original key on C trumpet or transposed on my 8310z Bb (together they result an awesome broad sound). If you want better endurance, the only good answer is to reduce unnecessary tension, work on your breath support, the amount of air you breathe in and the breathing breaks you take. I also recommend being warmed up directly before you play it - e.g. by playing into a mute while you are waiting for your performance, or in 2024, someone else.