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tptptp
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 Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:57 am Post subject: |
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| Bandcity wrote: | | Brass band arrangements of Beatles tunes or other familiar pieces that change the rhythm or otherwise try to be cute. |
I agree. Also, I don't have anything specific to cite, but changing the chords of a familiar song to be cute is annoying and contrived, and the audience usually doesn't appreciate it either.
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Brassnose
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 6:15 am Post subject: |
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Take Five in 4/4 (yes, it’s been done …  ).
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tptptp
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 6:26 am Post subject: |
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| Brassnose wrote: | | Take Five in 4/4 (yes, it’s been done … ). |
Hurts my head to think about it.
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Man Of Constant Sorrow
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Joined: 25 Jun 2023
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 9:01 am Post subject: |
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Having to play "TAPS", and/or "Amazing Grace", at a memorial-service, following a force majeure.
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Last edited by Man Of Constant Sorrow on Sun Dec 03, 2023 11:55 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Tony Scodwell
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Joined: 17 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 9:25 am Post subject: Playing situations to dislike |
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I feel fortunate to not have played much Broadway music. I did play a show a while back which told me I didn't want to do much more. It seems like the arrangers felt ascending lines with double flats and descending lines with double sharps were totally fine. The singers felt the need to cut a bar here and there (or just a few notes) so the roadmap became more than a bit difficult to read. And let's not talk about the keys the music was in. Do the singers really need 7 sharps to fit their range? Previously when doing a production show here in Las Vegas (Siegfried and Roy) in my role as contractor and lead trumpet, I was able to have a copyist on call when the "stars" changed the music frequently. The books were always cleanly copied and up to date so any sub that got called in (usually at the last minute) would have a fighting chance at the music. A page full of pencil marks and hard to decipher changes is something that will tax your ability with music directors thinking it's you making the mistakes. And let's not get started on less than talented music directors.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
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peanuts56
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Joined: 21 Nov 2021
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 11:10 am Post subject: Re: Playing situations to dislike |
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| Tony Scodwell wrote: | I feel fortunate to not have played much Broadway music. I did play a show a while back which told me I didn't want to do much more. It seems like the arrangers felt ascending lines with double flats and descending lines with double sharps were totally fine. The singers felt the need to cut a bar here and there (or just a few notes) so the roadmap became more than a bit difficult to read. And let's not talk about the keys the music was in. Do the singers really need 7 sharps to fit their range? Previously when doing a production show here in Las Vegas (Siegfried and Roy) in my role as contractor and lead trumpet, I was able to have a copyist on call when the "stars" changed the music frequently. The books were always cleanly copied and up to date so any sub that got called in (usually at the last minute) would have a fighting chance at the music. A page full of pencil marks and hard to decipher changes is something that will tax your ability with music directors thinking it's you making the mistakes. And let's not get started on less than talented music directors.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
Tony's remark about neatly copied music triggered a memory. Way back in 76 or 77 I played a water show on the 4th of July that was being held at a small stadium. The pools used traveled with the show.
We sightread the music and it was a nightmare. Hand copied on staff paper and I remember the arranger tried to jam in a measure at the end of the staff several times. Problem was they barely fit. They sat us too close to the pool and some of the guys playing got soaked as well. |
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Man Of Constant Sorrow
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Joined: 25 Jun 2023
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 12:02 pm Post subject: Re: Playing situations to dislike |
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| Tony Scodwell wrote: | ... And let's not get started on less than talented music directors.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
Yeah ... and, they have the unmitigated gaul to abbreviate "MD", as if they are actually Medical Doctors ... thinking they can foist it upon unwitting prols.
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peanuts56
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 12:50 pm Post subject: Re: Playing situations to dislike |
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| Man Of Constant Sorrow wrote: | | Tony Scodwell wrote: | ... And let's not get started on less than talented music directors.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
Yeah ... and, they have the unmitigated gaul to abbreviate "MD", as if they are actually Medical Doctors ... thinking they can foist it upon unwitting prols.
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I remember a Seinfeld episode where Elaine was dating a conductor. He insisted everyone address him as Maestro!! |
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bike&ed
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2023 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Jolivet Heptade, John Williams’s trumpet concerto, and anything by Thierry Escaich. They sound amazing, but are just plain psychotically difficult… |
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Seymor B Fudd
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| Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2023 7:24 am Post subject: |
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Having played in our brassband since 1958 I´ve been forced to play the well known song by Kurt Noack (Op5) Heinzelmännschens Wachtparade ( https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=163318&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=20 ) at every Christmas concert at the local church ever since. Originally a somewhat corny but lively piece of music I´ve become extremely allergic to it.
But that doesn´t help. Only way out is to quit the band but that´s not an option. Although I nowadays sub only at concerts, at other times having the ball of my life in different big bands.
Tunes that are played over and over again and then again tend to loose their meaning. At least when heard from my ears. As if the brain finally reacts to the message "YES I KNOW don´t you ever tell me again".
Reminds me of an early childhold game when repeating a certain word umpteen times made it nonsense like.
I recall the start of our swing band; as our theme song to be played every time we began our concert (which we did every monday 7 years in a row at the local university restaurant) we played Dinah. The banjo man began, to be followed by the sousaphone man and then the drums with us collectively singing (well..) "the name of this band is - Atle the name of this band is Atle...the name of this band is Atle yeah..) After 2 years we just couldn´t play it any longer. All kinds of wacky ad lib playing seemed to pop up and finally we realized no more!
Enters next theme song - Stand By as played by Harry Arnold´s Radio Big Band
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=Luvy5RarCAs ).
Obviously the metamorphosis of our band was well under way; no sousaphone, banjo, instead full modern rhythm section 4 saxes, 3 trombones, trumpets but that´s another story.
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Seymor B Fudd
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2023 7:39 am Post subject: |
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Update!
Day after I wrote the above I came down with a mild cold still effectively
preventing me from playing at the church concert, tomorrow, Sunday.
So I´m excused from playing those Heinzelmännschen!
A sheer coincidence or??? 
On the other hand this is the first time since 1958.......Once I played with something that afterwards was diagnosed as tonsillitis nearly fainting in the middle of the concert.
As time goes by.
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2023 8:09 am Post subject: |
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Dare I say it?
* In the Mood
* Stars and Stripes Forever
After half a century of having to play these (admittedly good works), I'm just maxed out.
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Man Of Constant Sorrow
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2023 8:48 am Post subject: |
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| Seymor B Fudd wrote: |
... no sousaphone, banjo |
Not long ago, I attended an acoustic coffee-house performance. A duo, with a middle-age lady on tuba, and an elderly man on banjo (both 5-string "Scruggs-style", which is difficult; and 4-string plectrum and "claw-style").
The man sang, rather well. The woman was amazing.
The repertoire was mainly Americana/Appalachian folk, ragtime, early standards, show tunes, along with some bluegrass.
The were VERY GOOD ... VERY.
Quite entertaining ! 
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BStrad43
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2023 10:29 am Post subject: |
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I have two big ones:
Mozarts version of the Messiah and then getting yelled out for not play the high note in the Hallelujah Chorus because you were reading what was given to you. (There is no High Concert D in that one) I have learned a long time ago to either memorize the lick or bring your own copy of the original.
And the arrangements that put three or more parts on one line and expect the three or more of you to nail a sight reading of fast passages. There is a new invention called a computer with music notation programs that will split up the parts. USE IT!!!!!!! |
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2023 11:45 am Post subject: |
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| BStrad43 wrote: | | I have two big ones. |
That's nice to know. 
| Quote: | | I have learned a long time ago to either memorize the lick or bring your own copy of the original. |
Or ask the conductor, politely, "Sir, would you like me to play the "D" or what's on the page"?
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RandyTX
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| Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2023 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| BStrad43 wrote: | | There is a new invention called a computer with music notation programs that will split up the parts. USE IT!!!!!!! |
Bingo. solo cornet parts in brass band arrangements, especially the older ones, where they try to cram everything onto one page to save paper can be a total nightmare. For those that aren't familiar with BB's, the 'solo' part is often divisi lines for four (usually) players. Sometimes it's unison, other times it broken apart into 2, 3, or even 4 parallel lines on the same staff.
More modern arrangements tend to break them up, either separate staffs on the same page, or separate parts Solo 1,2 on one part, 3,4 on the other, etc.
Anyway, the real nightmares come in when you have something like a 16th note runs (forgive me for not knowing what sort of 'quaver' that is in british parlance)... with accidentals all over the run, and them being 'inherited' or canceled out earlier in the bar by one of the other player's lines in that same bar.
You either memorize your part of it very carefully, so you don't have to look at that chicken scratch on the page ever again, or you break out your handy-dandy engraving software and rewrite the part so it's actually readable.
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Dale Proctor
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| Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2023 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| RandyTX wrote: | | BStrad43 wrote: | | There is a new invention called a computer with music notation programs that will split up the parts. USE IT!!!!!!! |
Bingo. solo cornet parts in brass band arrangements, especially the older ones, where they try to cram everything onto one page to save paper can be a total nightmare. For those that aren't familiar with BB's, the 'solo' part is often divisi lines for four (usually) players. Sometimes it's unison, other times it broken apart into 2, 3, or even 4 parallel lines on the same staff.
More modern arrangements tend to break them up, either separate staffs on the same page, or separate parts Solo 1,2 on one part, 3,4 on the other, etc.
Anyway, the real nightmares come in when you have something like a 16th note runs (forgive me for not knowing what sort of 'quaver' that is in british parlance)... with accidentals all over the run, and them being 'inherited' or canceled out earlier in the bar by one of the other player's lines in that same bar.
You either memorize your part of it very carefully, so you don't have to look at that chicken scratch on the page ever again, or you break out your handy-dandy engraving software and rewrite the part so it's actually readable. |
Man, I’ve been there before! It’s even better when the parts cross within the staff and you can barely tell where your line went until you analyze the direction of the note tails. That accidental in one part that also applies to a note you have in the measure drives me crazy. Would it have been too much trouble to write it on your note, too? But really, saving a few pieces of paper seems to be the only reason for combining a bunch of parts on one sheet. I’ve been known to run a copy of the piece and white-out all the extraneous parts… 
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Rapier232
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| Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 7:45 am Post subject: |
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Anything that has the name Frank Baernarts in the corner!
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kehaulani
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| Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| Rapier232 wrote: | | Anything that has the name Frank Baernarts in the corner! |
I would like to add a caveat for anyone looking for music for an intermediate school or community band, I've found some of these arrangements very useable.
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zaferis
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| Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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yes, recently. An arrangement of the US Armed Service Songs that was so bad that the service members in attendance, whom it was intended to honor, didn't even recognize their own songs.
I've offered on several occasions to supply a number of far better arrangements but, as is rampant in the US right now, listening to the experts is out of favor.
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