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Did the mouthpiece feel "right" to you as a beginn


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Did the mp feel like it "fit" when you were a beginner?
Yes, felt right from day one
22%
 22%  [ 4 ]
It took a while but eventually it did
16%
 16%  [ 3 ]
Didn't feel right at first and I still struggle with it
16%
 16%  [ 3 ]
I don't remember, feels good now
33%
 33%  [ 6 ]
Took years for me to figure out how to make it feel right
11%
 11%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 18

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Robert P
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 2:33 am    Post subject: Did the mouthpiece feel "right" to you as a beginn Reply with quote

If you remember, how long did it take for the mp to feel like it really fit or belonged on your lips?
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abontrumpet
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have floated/posited the idea that before puberty, individual possess low somatic awareness. That, combined with inexperience on the instrument, results in "unawareness" for a very (relatively) long time.

Most young beginners don't seem to really "feel" the mouthpiece and they are very far away from "feeling a sense of belonging" of the mouthpiece. That is the "blessing" they are given (they don't have to think as much -- while adult beginners have the curse of somatic awareness); they just approach the instrument from a position of "play."

That being said, personally, I never thought about mouthpiece and the way it felt until undergrad. In middle/high school, I played middle of the road name brands (Yamaha and Bach). Now, depending on the year/month/week/day, the mouthpiece feels more at home versus other days. At an advanced level, it's obvious when a mouthpiece has the potential to work for you and when it will not. Often, "comfort" is a product of "good efficient playing" more than the specs of a mouthpiece. When I play poorly, my mouthpiece feels terrible and vice versa.
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Seymor B Fudd
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 7:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On second thoughts, I honestly do not remember! Only thing I know is that when the Salvation Army no 1 seemed too narrow I consulted the local dealer who handed me a V B 1 1/4 C telling me this is a very good mouthpiece. (And it was a very good fit to my King)
That´s it. And I used it some 30 years, never reflecting how come. Trumpet and cornet versions.
During all these years I tested a lot of other mouthpieces none of which served me better.
So sheer luck or? Might add that no formal lessons up til I got 72, the first year aside, 1957.
Growing old thus always looking for things making playing more easy I have switched to Schilke, same width (14), different letters etc etc. Nicer rim.
However, the other day I got an opportunity to play an old V B 1 1/4C again. It worked just fine......
Making me wonder how come I switched???

Take away??? You tell me!
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Billy B
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have never paid any attention to how it feels. My focus is on how it sounds.
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jhatpro
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ACB TA1 felt right immediately.
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abontrumpet
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy B wrote:
I have never paid any attention to how it feels. My focus is on how it sounds.


Let's dig into this. Do you mean to say you have played the same set of mouthpieces for your entire professional career? Do you mean to say that you would play a 1C and a 10.5B in the same gig if it provided the sound you needed?
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Andy Cooper
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conn 4 cornet mouthpiece. It was terrible in 1957. My opinion has not changed.

I now use a Neill Sanders 17M.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

abontrumpet wrote:
Billy B wrote:
I have never paid any attention to how it feels. My focus is on how it sounds.


Let's dig into this. ...

--------------------------------------------
At first glance I thought Billy's response odd ...

BUT, it really does get down to 'how it sounds' -
That criteria likely INCLUDES the sound throughout a long session, multiple hard days, range, etc. And that means that the physiology of 'how it fits and feels' HAS TO WORK in order to successfully allow the desired sound to be produced.
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Rhondo
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn’t pick up a trumpet (or any other wind instrument) until age 40.

I didn’t really think about the mouthpiece; it was just part of this thing called a trumpet that I was trying to make a sound on that didn’t sound sour.

As I progressed to make a good sound I still never thought about it. The only thing I thought about was if that ‘thing’ was difficult to play on a given day or if it was going well.

My trumpet did come with 2 different mouthpieces, and whether it was obvious to me right away or I was advised to use the Bach Corp. 5C instead of the Schilke 14a4a, I set the Schilke aside and played the 5C- never considering any other choice.
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JWG
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mouthpieces have to fit you, not vice-versa.

If you try to fit your mouthpiece . . . arguably, you fall under Einstein's alleged definition of an idiot . . . a person who tries the same experiment over and over again and expects a different result.

You need to choose a rim diameter, width, contour, and alpha angle that works with your unique physiology. The size, thickness, and shape of your lips, your upper and lower jaw alignment/protrusion, and the size and alignment of your teeth will dictate the right mouthpiece.
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stuartissimo
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It’s too long ago to remember for me. I do know I wanted to play timpani at the time, not trumpet. I’m still not sure whether the/a mouthpiece feels right if I’m honest. I’m not a natural, never was.

Billy B wrote:
I have never paid any attention to how it feels. My focus is on how it sounds.

Even as a beginner?

JWG wrote:
Mouthpieces have to fit you, not vice-versa.

I don’t think the question was whether a player can tell a mouthpiece is right for them, but more like ‘when did you realize you were meant to be a trumpet player?’. At least that’s how I read it.
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abontrumpet
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayKosta wrote:

At first glance I thought Billy's response odd ...

And that means that the physiology of 'how it fits and feels'


How it feels is explicitly not a consideration. You are letting your experience as a human being shade your interpretation (because it is an outlandish thing to say).

If one truly never once considered feeling, you could play a student horn vs pro horn because "feel" is never part of it. You wouldn't even need to try out a horn, try two different mouthpieces etc. Everything is obviously sound driven, but a human cannot pretend to not consider that something is uncomfortable, a bad horn is bad, etc., unless they have severe nerve or brain damage.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

abontrumpet wrote:
... but a human cannot pretend to not consider that something is uncomfortable, a bad horn is bad, etc., ...

---------------------------------
And perhaps for Billy, the recognition and consideration of uncomfortable, bad horn, etc. quickly makes him believe (from experience) that the sound will not be acceptable.

One way of thinking about it is that in most cases, the GOAL is to have 'good playing' (sound?), and not to have comfort, or to get enjoyment from how well an instrument mechanically works.
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abontrumpet
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayKosta wrote:
One way of thinking about it is that in most cases, the GOAL is to have 'good playing' (sound?), and not to have comfort, or to get enjoyment from how well an instrument mechanically works.


I am very familiar with the Adam school and agree with the tenets of it (along with Chicago's Song and Wind etc.) but not in the way it is often presented. I understand what the GOAL is, but if you were "very uncomfortable" playing the trumpet, you wouldn't progress very far. It is essential you have some idea of "feeling" otherwise you will not progress.

You are giving a very generous interpretation of aspirational platitudes. I applaud you for it, but I am not asking YOU to interpret Billy B. I want to hear it from him. I want to see if he can explain it.
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Rhondo
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it sounds good it feels good, no?
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ellie
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an adult beginner (~6 months) I will say the mouthpiece still feels strange to me and my mouthpiece placement is inconsistent even now. Also I have not tried too many mouthpieces but I cannot feel too much of a difference in rim size, angles and other things that veterans talk about. It seems simply impossible for us beginners to evaluate a mouthpiece in any meaningful way with our extremely limited range, and general instability... with the exception of a Denis Wick 4B which, within 5min of trying, I knew I never wanted to touch ever again
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CaptPat
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was a beginner in 4th grade so my memory is a bit hazy. At the time one adapted to the mouthpiece provided by the manufacturer, there was no talk about different sizes, shapes, etc. It wasn't painful or even weird, and after a bit of coaching recognizable sounds issued. I didn't move on to a different mouthpiece until high school, a Bach of some version. I was convinced it improved my playing by quite a bit -- probably confirmation bias.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

abontrumpet wrote:
... but I am not asking YOU to interpret Billy B. I want to hear it from him. I want to see if he can explain it.

-------------------------------
Yep, getting a more complete explanation from Billy would provide more info.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
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JayKosta
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ellie wrote:
As an adult beginner (~6 months) I will say the mouthpiece still feels strange to me and my mouthpiece placement is inconsistent even now. ...

------------------------------------
At beginner level the criteria for fit and feel can be more generous.
1) No lip pain or injury
2) Not so big that you feel that your lips are falling into the cup
3) Small enough so that your lips are supporting the rim

If inconsistent 'rim setting' continues, then consider if alignment and position of your teeth is the cause. Sometimes small changes in the contour of the rim can make a noticeable difference in how the rim fits you. e.g. rim 'roundness', location of 'high point', taper inward and outward, etc.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
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patdublc
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy B wrote:
I have never paid any attention to how it feels. My focus is on how it sounds.


^^^^Exactly this. I have never cared how the mouthpiece felt on my face.
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