Pedal Tones

nceagle13 · Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 3:25 pm Post subject:

What are your opinions on pedal and their effect on upper register playing!

_bugleboy · Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 4:01 pm Post subject:

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?topic=708&forum=2

trptdoc · Veteran Member Joined: 01 May 2003 Posts: 246

My thoughts on PEDALS: 1: they help keep the embochure "up"(most players tend slip lower in the altissimo range), thus allowing more tissue to vibrate creating a bigger,fatter sound(more overtones and more intense vibrating wave form). 2:they help keep the center of the embochure relaxed if practiced in the correct way-- holding the same position( feel) as you come up out of the pedals. 3: they allow the tongue to learn to control the pitch effectively because of #1 and #2. 4: Holding the pedal and blowing forcefully until all air is exhausted and the chest muscles quiver, allows the muscles of respiration to develop the strength and coordination needed for the altissiomo register without the tension of trying to play high. 5:if practiced incorrectly the pedals will not help and may hinder development.
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EBjazz · Posted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:11 pm Post subject:

Uh-Ohhh. Looks like another student of Claude, and I think I know him. Somebody alert the moderators, these guys are nothin' but trouble.

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pedaltonekid · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Nov 2001 Posts: 1711

For me they help.
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John Mohan · Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 2:51 pm Post subject:

Jerry Freedman · Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 3:09 pm Post subject:

You oughta meet up with Mr. Hollywood who just said in one the forums that he wishes more players would play pedal tones so he could make more money

Mr.Hollywood · Heavyweight Member Joined: 14 Dec 2002 Posts: 1730

I think it would be great if every trumpet player spent hours a day on pedals.

Chris

[ This Message was edited by: Mr.Hollywood on 2004-04-03 01:01 ]

trumpetmike · Posted: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:09 am Post subject:

Until I went to university I had never heard of pedal tones, nor many other aspects of trumpet playing that we take for granted (flexibility, long notes, and technical scale exercises). I think this says more for the standard of teaching I was receiving than anything else (it was very poor!).
My tone was poor (I know this now) yet my range was good.
My teacher introduced me to pedal tones and insisted that they should be done with my normal embouchure (which I think is the most important aspect about them – you should not change your embouchure to play them). I found them very difficult to start with, but as they improved I did notice benefits in my playing. My tone was filling out and my flexibility (especially in the high register) improved.
They worked for me.
I use them with my advanced pupils, not just because I think they are useful tools for tone, flexibility and range, but because you DO find pieces which use them.
I have played a couple of solo pieces that require them (contemporary pieces), a few orchestral pieces that need them (some of the Mozart and Haydn symphonies require these pieces – they were not out of the ordinary to the natural trumpeters of the day), some trumpet ensemble pieces that need them and even a brass band (usually a style of ensemble that is firmly against all extended techniques) piece that used them.

They are obviously not useful for everybody, but I use them and find them beneficial.

pedaltonekid · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Nov 2001 Posts: 1711

The beauty of pedal tones (if done correctly) is that one doesn't have to do them hours each day - nor should they. 5 minutes or so will serve as adequate time for most pedal routines. Being able to play in that register is also very beneficial for learning to do lip bends.
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fuzzyjon79 · Posted: Sat Apr 03, 2004 7:02 am Post subject:

I have never done pedal tones on a serious level mostly because I'm not exactly sure how pedal tones are defined.... I have always considered pedal tones to be those notes below low F#? Is this correct? Should you always strive to use your "natural embouchure" to play pedal tones even though they are so low?
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trptdoc · Veteran Member Joined: 01 May 2003 Posts: 246

In my view pedals are everything below low F#. From F# down to 1st pedal C feels wierd and is a hard concept to get at first, so lots of players never really learn to use the pedals correctly. Below pedal C the notes are much more musical and easier to feel. I have students start with F#(123) and force it flat to the pedal F to get the "feel". The jaw must drop into the deep "aw" position. I use pedals in solo work and hear Arturo and others use them too. The real old timers(Kryl,Clarke,etc) can be heard playing triple forte pedals to above double C on some of the old "Edison" wax rolls.
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EBjazz · Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 8:11 am Post subject:

Once again- a complete pedal tone demo and lecture on my site in the sig below. You can access the demo from the front page.

Eb
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Eric Bolvin
http://bolvinmusic.com/product/the-modern-jazz-trumpet-method/
www.bolvinmusic.com

Larrin · Regular Member Joined: 10 Apr 2004 Posts: 39

I can play the notes below F# to C with 123, but hard as I try, I cannot play C open. I always skip down to like the F, and can never bring it up any higher than around an A. Am I doing something wrong?

_bugleboy · Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2004 3:52 pm Post subject:

Don't even bother trying at this point. Play the pedal C 123 if that's the way it will come out for you. Nothing wrong with doing it that way at all.

trumpetmike · Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2004 3:57 pm Post subject:

If you want to play it open (although as has just been suggested, you don't NEED to do it this way), try practising it with a harmon mute. I have found (both with my playing and with my students) that this helps a great deal in settling the pitch. When this gives an easy note, try it on a cup mute, then a straight, then open. It seems to help.

Might also be worth trying it on a flugel, if you have one. I find the pedal register much easier on a flugel.

trpt.hick · Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2004 1:01 pm Post subject:

Pedals have been around since the dawn of the trumpet. Some baroque trumpet method books dating back 400 years say how pedal tones can helf strengthen the embouchure. Personally, I think they are great. They have had the most positive effect on my overall playing.

To quote Herbert Clarke:

"If I could only practice one note, it would be pedal C (open). It is to be played correctly or else left alone."

Dave Hickman

Atomlinson · Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2004 1:38 pm Post subject:

Hi Dave

Where does that quote come from? I don't recall seeing it in his 4 volume method or his autobiography. So perhaps it comes from one of the articles he wrote for magazines.

Andrew Tomlinson

trpt.hick · Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 2:23 pm Post subject:

I'm not sure where it originally came from. I first heard it quoted by Claude Gordon (a Clarke student) in one of his clinics. I also have one of his clinics transcribed word for word (I believe it's published now) which has it in there as well.

Maybe someone else would know, but I seem to recall it in Gordon's book, "Trumpet Playing Is No More Difficult Than Deep Breathing." (not positive on this one)

Dave Hickman

Mr.Hollywood · Heavyweight Member Joined: 14 Dec 2002 Posts: 1730

From what I have heard Clarke did not use pedals.

He was highly critical of his Sousa section mate Harold Stambaugh who used them all the time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that there are no written pedals in any of Clakes books, nor are there any written pedals in any of Clarkes solos (as there where in Jules Levy's or Bohimir Kryl's)

Chris