Claude Gordon forum

Emb_Enh · Veteran Member Joined: 29 Oct 2002 Posts: 455

Thanks very much to John Mohan - - a very knowledgable CG forum moderator/advocate.

Who is the "we" you mentioned Todd?

Roddy o-iii<O
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"E M B O U C H U R E___E N H A N C E M E N T"
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[Self Analysis and Diagnostic Trumpet Method]

histrumpet · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 4:05 am Post subject:

Todd has done alot behind the scenes to try and diffuse this whole situation that has come to pass. A standard of conduct was created for each moderator to follow, is Todd to blame that one completely disregarded this code of conduct? I have seen a problem child in a group setting who's bad behavior was encouraged by others who laughed at his antics, the attention given caused the child to act even worse. It may be that instead of patting him on the back those that were urging him on should have tried to help him conform to the standard of behavior for a forum moderator. I don't think Quad or any others can blame Todd or anyone else but themselves for what has happened.

John Mohan · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 4:05 am Post subject:

I'll make this brief.

I have already spent a whole lot more of my (practice) time on the Herald then I should have.

1) I keep seeing the SC people claiming that I attack other "methods" constantly. This is factually incorrect (as a lot of their claims tend to be).

I have stated my opinions of SC and these opinions tend to be in the negative. SC is a "method", not "methods". I have been quite supportive of the other forums and (proven) methods such as the "Bill Adams", "Chicago School" and others.

2) I posted a bit of a bluff the other day - I wrote that I was able to delete all the crap posted by "bachboy2" in about 45 seconds. This was an effort on my part to persuade him not to spend hours of his time ruining our forums. Although the TH Administrator is currently creating a querie that can and will delete everything posted by such a jerk instantly, this was not actually the case as of yesterday.

I actually sat for nearly TWO HOURS deleting each and every post left by "bachboy 2" on the Claude Gordon forum. And I received a kindly worded Private Message from the administrator thanking me for my time and dedication to this matter and to the CG forum in general. And then, upon arriving home from the theater last night, I find that I've been "removed" as the CG Moderator by this same administrator.

I've NEVER felt so backstabbed in all my life.

It is a sad day when a few aggressive individuals interested in promoting and profitting financially from their own agenda (hidden away in a private forum) can reach out from their private little profit center and cause this to happen to someone who did nothing more than dedicate his time and energy (with no financial gains planned or realized) to helping those out there who want to improve their ability as trumpet players.

Sincerely,

John Mohan
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Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
1st Trpt for Cats, Phantom of the Opera, West Side Story, Evita, Hunchback of Notre Dame,
Grease, The Producers, Addams Family, In the Heights, etc.
Ex LA Studio Musician
16 Year Claude Gordon Student

jakepainter · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 5:46 am Post subject:

Re-instate John

The issue here isn’t whether you think john is a nice or nasty guy. If john’s comments have in some way overstepped legal boundaries then fair enough John has to go, but if John’s sacking as Claude Gordon forum moderator is just based on the fact that he writes “vindictive” comments, it is wrong.

I have met John in person and one thing is for sure John Mohan knows what he is talking about when it comes to the teachings of Claude Gordon. Surely for that reason alone he should stay.

I don’t agree with everything John says, in fact, I don’t even practise exclusively Claude Gordon technique, but if he offends you, don’t read his posts, simple as that.
John has seriously helped me out with my playing, and many others too, and it will be a great shame if he isn’t re-instated.

Murray · Regular Member Joined: 18 Nov 2001 Posts: 94

I second the motion. Re-instate John.

spanky · Heavyweight Member Joined: 18 Jul 2002 Posts: 535

WOW, go to bed, wake up and, as mr. bentley would say "NUCLEAR EXPLOSION". WOW, WOW, are you kidding. what happened to FREEDOM OF SPEECH?? did/do all the moderators have to agree not to say something that other methods won't like?? just curious. while i didn't agree with the way john went about his business sometimes, does he not have the right to voice his opinion, dogmatic as it may be?? since mr. bentley dosn't like some of my posts, does that mean i can't post anymore??

i know, blood, sweat, tears,broken bones, gunfire, tornados, hurricanes, nuclear explosions and the like, go ahead and let me have it bentley.

WWWWOOOOOOOOWWWWWW

[ This Message was edited by: spanky on 2002-09-19 09:54 ]

[ This Message was edited by: spanky on 2002-09-19 09:55 ]

John Mohan · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 7:17 am Post subject:

trickg · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 7:50 am Post subject:

Blue Devil · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 9:27 am Post subject:

spanky · Heavyweight Member Joined: 18 Jul 2002 Posts: 535

oh mike that's awful, terrible, how could you say something like that??

i'm with you, just curious how this happened and what the rules for the moderators are??

walter · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 9:50 am Post subject:

I'm very disappointed in reading of John Mohan's removal as CG moderator. I know that some of the people who post on the TH consider Johns comments and challenges to be "bashing", but I just don't see their point. I don't read everything that John Mohan writes, but from what I've seen, he maintains a consistent tone of honest and fair discourse. Of course, to John's detractors, I'm a "Mohan minion"; I believe that I was even labeled as such at one time [Isn't this a form of bashing].

I assume that much of the criticism of John has to do with stuff that he wrote in the SuperChops forum. I don't know most of what went on in there, since I gave up on trying to learn more about Jerome Callet's work from his adherents here at the TH. Now that the SC forum is closed, I have no way of determining if the criticisms of John are valid or simply the Big Lie, which if said often enough, becomes the accepted truth.

BTW: I did receive emails from someone who was booted out of the SC forum [a current student of Callet's] for apparently not posting politically correct material. My correspondence with this SC "black sheep" was informative, and even though I questioned him about what he was learning from Callet, our emails never degenerated into what I've seen so often from the SC clique at the TH.

Since the TH moderator never cited his reasons for dumping John Mohan, or, even better yet, offered the proof of Mohan's indiscretions, the only people who will understand the reason for Mohan's displacement will be those who apparently need no reason nor proof.

This whole affair sours my feelings for the TH. I know that there ARE important people in the trumpet world who read, and occasionally pseudonymously post here. John is an example of the level of player [an active pro of undisputed ability] that we want to attract to the Forum. I feel that if I'm dissuaded from coming to, let alone posting on, this site, then the TH will probably fall away from the interest of anyone outside of the clique that seems to serve as a modern day Inquisition.

The Forum has seemed to serve as a place that can include academic [as in Plato's ideals] discussion of ideas. It seems to be moving towards the "scholastic" ideal: one in which the only discussion that will be tolerated is one that supports the dogma of those who, by force of intimidation, set the agenda of what is OK and what is not OK. These people are narrow-minded bullies, and their tactics are in the style of radical fundamentalism ... something that we should all be wary of in today's world.

I expect the bashing that John has received to come my way ... as it has before. What a pathetic way for people to behave in a site that should be above the fray of unsupported, personal attack.

walter
wsharshon@hotmail.com.

Pedro · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Nov 2001 Posts: 539

Man! Talk about a gut punch!!! Like everyone, I've witnessed in reading, some of the arguments that went on. However, John knew what he was talking about when it came to the Gordon method. I also agree with him in that from what I read, most of the turmoil originated within discussions about SC and its advocators. Is one method superior to another...Think NOT! Anyway, I share the sentiments of many when I say, John's help and knowledge will surely be missed!!! Best to ya' John!!!

bj · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 10:35 am Post subject:

Vessehune · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 11:20 am Post subject:

This is a bunch of CRAP! I personally found TH through searching for Claude Gordon materials on the internet. Since then I have taken lessons with John and gained much respect for his skills as a player and a teacher.

This is totally uncalled for and unacceptable. I will be checking to see if John wil be reinstated. If not TH will be removed from my regular surfing time. I don't want to be a part of a group of people still stuck in second grade. If you can't handle people confronting your opinions don't give them. Whining to the teacher (SA) about how little Johny called you a name (disagreed with your post(s)) is childish.

If you'll excuse me I have to go practice my Claude Gordon materials so I can learn to play properly.

Max Reverb · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 11:42 am Post subject:

I applaud the action. A moderator holds a position of responsibility. John has continually acted irresponsibly in forums outside of CG. There's a great example of it in the recent Pop's McLaughlin threads in Fundamentals. If we were in real space instead of cyberspace, Mr. McLaughlin would have a legitimate defamation of character case against Mohan. I think Mohan has been gone from the states too long and forgot his American manners. I'd like to know why he left in the first place. I don't think he could cut it here, so he left so he could be a big fish in a small pond. He obviously has some ego/confidence problems and must get some kind of satisfaction putting other people down. There is no place for this kind of behavior here. I hope others who condescend on people will stand up and take notice.

spanky · Heavyweight Member Joined: 18 Jul 2002 Posts: 535

THERE'S AN ECHO IN HERE.

OK, SO YOU PUT MOHAN DOWN AND THEN TURNAROUND AND SAY THERE'S NO ROOM FOR THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR. OOOKKKKAAAAYYYYY/ :???:

[ This Message was edited by: spanky on 2002-09-19 14:55 ]

comebackkid · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 11:50 am Post subject:

Thats what I call MAXIMUM REVERB..Reverb..reverb...!!!!

[ This Message was edited by: comebackkid on 2002-09-19 14:51 ]

bj · Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 12:46 pm Post subject:

Pedro · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Nov 2001 Posts: 539

Well said Brian!!! Although we in the US to some extent enjoy the ability to somewhat flourish" with the availability of venues and potential for performance, it has no bearing on the ability of players from overseas and abroad. I've always thought that trumpet players were a "brotherhood". Sure, we may not always agree with each other's opinions but the fact that we chose to tackle the "beast" we know and love as the Trumpet, merits respect no matter WHERE you're from or where and with whom you choose to share your craft and knowledge!! I'm fortunate enough to have friends from different backgrounds, nationalities, etc. All of whom are formidable players in thier own right. Its a lot of fun to learn how they came to the US or why they went back overseas. I can tell you this though, if they went back, it DEFINITELY had nothing to do with playing abilities!!