Tonguing high notes

[Young Man with a Horn]

I find it much easier to slur up to high notes as opposed to tonguing them.

Can anyone suggest any exercises to help improve my tongue in the upper register?

Cheers

[_trumpetgod_02]

AIR!!!! Control. Support. Coordination. It comes with practice. try playing scales multiple octaves. And if I remember correctly you are a relatively new player. Steady practice learning to control your air, with a positive long sighted plan is the best bet.

Nick
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[Young Man with a Horn]

I'm not a relatively new player, but I'm always willing to learn new things!

Thanks for your help Nick

[_trumpetgod_02]

Sorry about the mistake, must have you confused with one of the 1,700+ other members here But I think that the same rule applies either way. Give it time and patience, and a good attitude and the best results are yours to be had.


Best of luck,
Nick
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[PorkChops]

Sounds like you're at that pivitol point in your playing right now, when you have the air moving fast enough to get up there, but you don't have enough support to keep the notes going while you're tonguing. Remember that the tongue stops the whole show, and it takes good compression to get the note going, in that split second the tongue releases... the only way to improve your game now is to put MORE air into the horn during tongued passages, and use more support.

You might do some sit-ups everyday, and be mindful of your air and support when you start going up there, it takes STRENGTH to play high.

TrumpetGod_02 is right, it takes time! (and dedication, and smart practice too ofcourse)

[Kateeba]

Young Man......
I've experienced that problem and what seemed to help me was to work slowly upward tonguing. Here is what worked for me:

Start tonguing upwards cromatically with a nice strong attack. When you get to the "area" were you can tongue one note, but the next half step gives you trouble or is really weak , start working from that note by doing some series of quarter notes and eventually faster attacks. Don't stay up there too long doing that though. Work from there down and up again cromatically.

Also, you might start on a C in the staff and work upwards tonguing from the C to a C# then C to D so that every other note is the C .....on up to that comfort note. Then do it from G in the staff, then from low C, then from low G (1 & 3). Work up cromatically in this way and every few days (or so often) try to move up one half step on the high notes. You should find that after a week or so notes you could not comfortably tongue are easier and that "problem" area starts sliding up.

Now, there are some excellent trumpet embouchure people here that may have much better advice. I am not a great high not player, but I can comfortably tongue up to G (just below double high C) and get a nice full, strong, sound, and "peck" (tongue, but not quite as strong yet) from high G to Double high C.

Hope this helps and maybe Pops or Roddy may give you some better advice, but like I said, it worked for me. Oh yeah, you should also try playing up there soft as well as strongly.......that helps too.

Lou
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Hear my music at: www.enchantedvibrations.net

[Pops]

[ This Message was edited by: Pops on 2003-05-13 13:35 ]

[dbacon]

Air blows the tongue out of the way.



Dave Bacon

[trptsbaker]

Double-tongue high D's and high G's on your leadpipe, no tuning bow. W/the mouthpiece in it, of course.

[_trumpetgod_02]

Pork Chops,

I just thought that I would clear this up, as Dave already has started to. The tongue does not "stop the whole show". Rather the tongue shouldmerely interrupt the air stream. Like a faucet with the water turned on. You shouldn't have to turn of the whole faucet to make a break in the stream, but rather just but something in the way of it to stop it momentarily. The same carries over to our playing.
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[MF Fan]

I've found that using the "K-tongue Modified Approach" works best for me. If you believe Herbert L. Clarke and Claude Gordon, it 's the method used by most accomplished players. Check out the CLaude Gordon Forum for specifics. In short, you don't use the traditional "tip of the tongue behind top teeth" approach, but rather anchor the tip of the tongue behind the lower teeth, and use the center of the tongue to articulate off the roof of your mouth. Thinking about it as striking the gum line just above the front teeth helps. Think about it: Tonguing this way requires you to have the tongue arched and forward, which is the set-up most use to produce notes above the staff. Since the tongue is already up there, you're eliminating most of the motion and air disruption that comes from the traditional method. Gordon labeled it "K-Tongue Modified" because it's very similar to the "Ku" motion used in double or triple tonguing, except it's done with the front of the tongue and involves more arch. In fact, Clarke (and Gordon) used this method as their PRIMARY single tonguing technique. It takes some practice, but once learned makes a lot of things easier on the horn, including upper register.

[ This Message was edited by: MF Fan on 2003-02-04 12:55 ]

[_trumpetgod_02]

MF,

Good post. I would jsut say be wary. That doesn't work for everyone. (clarke said so in his characteristic studies approach) And I spent a considerable ammount of time trying to pick that approach up and never really got it down. Just doesn't work for every one. However if it does work for you. Then all the power to you. Goood advice though.

Nick
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[musicmonkey]

Pops (or anyone else who can answer),
You say to practice Clarke, Stamp, and others up an octave. I see how this could help high register playing (learning by doing), but it also seems to neglect some possible problems. If people practice over and over in the higher registers, it seems to me they could develop bad habits (multiple embouchures for example) quickly. If you are playing Clarke up an octave (or Arban's characteristic studies) chances are you won't be focusing on technique and producing the high notes, but instead you will be trying to get the rhythms, etc. down.

It seems like a better idea, to me, to play a mix of high and lower register stuff, instead of spending all your time in the high register. Could the latter cause all the same problems of only playing in the lower registers, except in reverse?

I have a feeling that I'm not understanding your meaning correctly, and I would greatly appreciate a little clarification

mm

[Pops]

[ This Message was edited by: Pops on 2003-05-13 13:36 ]

[mark936]

I just finished up a good hour and fifteen mins. of High and low practice.

Did my Sys. Approach up a high G#.

Then I played "Hey Jude" starting on a F top line up to the high G's. F-A-C-G.

over and over. Probably 25 G's.

My neck hurts, my lower back hurts and I've got a headache the size of the US of Texas.

[John Mohan]

[_bugleboy]

John,

Herbert L. Clarke could single tongue sixteenth notes at over 160 bpm! Claude Gordon could do it at 144 bpm.

Is that four single tongue articulations per beat at quarter note = 160 bpm? Or, saying it another way, a total of 640 single tongued notes in one minute?

[_trumpetgod_02]

Hey Charly,

I believe so. The same statement is found in the front of the Chris Gekker tonging series book.

Nick
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[musicmonkey]

Hey pops, thanks for clarifying. I guess I understood you wrong the first time, but now I see the light How else can you get good at playing high other than by playing high?

mm

[HLABM]

Try Allan Colin's "Corners." You start on second line G and go up. Tongue everything. This will get you familiar with the "feel" of these notes.

Good Luck.
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Ken Roe

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