| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Pablo3
Regular Member
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 24
Location: Hamburg, NY
|
 Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:43 pm Post subject: C.G. Conn Vs. Bach Strad |
 |
|
What is your take on the C.G.Conn "Vintage One" Series?
Trumpet and Flugelhorn editions.
Perhaps compaired to Bach horns??? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ewetho
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 1264
Location: Kankakee, IL
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
When I got my Benge (almost new at $500, heck the valve just finished breaking in) I played both Bachs and V1s and me and the wife both preferred my sound on the V1 over the rest (Bach, Yamaha, Schilke, Benge and a few others) although the mouthpiece actually made a bigger change than the horns themselves. I was using a Bach 1B, 1C, and 1D to compare. Had a few others too. While the Bachs are different I get really close to the same sound with any of them and my line cannot tell them apart while we play unless I am really pushing the 1D.
Quite a few have noted they are a bit better than they thought. Heck when I did this I admittedly was a Conn hater. Never met one that made me smile at all. JUST ANOTHER HORN. Now I can say I actually like one. Good horn.
I found it to be in the small mainstream circle of sound. Not to far from a Xeno or Strad. Slightly different flavor.
Try one for yourself. You may like it. Some will not.
Once again I like it.
_________________
Kanstul Chicago 1001
CG Personal
Schilke 20D2d
Schilke 20D2d 22 throat |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pablo3
Regular Member
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 24
Location: Hamburg, NY
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I do own a Vintage One, I chose it over the Bach, i just found the Bach to be fuzzy & over-rated. I really liked the sound of the Conn, the design, and the package it came with.
I'm just interested in others opinions of the two.
thanks.
_________________
Thom Daly
C.G. Conn "Vintage One" Trumpet
C.G. Conn "Vintage One" Flugelhorn
King Tempo Cornet
Hammond Design/LOUD Mouthpieces
www.thomdaly.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hansonsf
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 670
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 6:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Here is the horn that Vincent Bach copied with the Strad 37. I played a Strad 25 for over a quarter century, but I prefer this one. If I only could have one horn this would be it.
1927 CONN 2B New World Symphony
Click. Copy URL. Paste in a new tab (window) to see full size |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LittleRusty
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 12664
Location: Gardena, Ca
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So you are questioning your choice of horns and are looking to validate your current horn by soliciting opinions?
There is a reason why Bach is top dog.
There is a reason why other brands of horns continue to be sold.
Rather than validating your experience with a bunch of strangers, ask your audience how they like the sound of you playing on the vintage 1. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ldwoods
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Sep 2004
Posts: 1843
Location: Lake Charles, LA
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: C.G. Conn Vs. Bach Strad |
|
|
| Pablo3 wrote: | What is your take on the C.G.Conn "Vintage One" Series?
Trumpet and Flugelhorn editions.
Perhaps compaired to Bach horns??? |
I have owned and played a few Vintage Ones and they were very fine horns. The one I liked best had the smaller leadpipe (36?) and red brass bell. It was really sweet, one of those I should have kept. The other one was better than any generic Bach 37 I've played. The third one I bought for a friend and have only played very briefly. It too was better than any Bach 37 I ever owned or tried.
IMHO, the Vintage One is under rated and is a great value in the used market.
Edit to clarify. I am talking trumpets, I have no experience with Bach or Vintage One flugels.
_________________
Larry Woods
LDWoods |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
so55
Veteran Member
Joined: 19 Aug 2004
Posts: 219
|
| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 3:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| The most important characteristics of V1 is its full and rich sound. Use a Curry TF, it'll be dark and smokey. Use a lead mpc, it'll scream without getting thin and screechy. No matter which register you're playing in, it's always full and rich. It's darker than a Strad 37 but you'll be amazed how easily it will sizzle when you push it. The square and round slides make a difference. It's almost like having two different trumpets. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tom LeCompte
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 3341
Location: Naperville, Illinois
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I think it's probably a mistake to lump the trumpet and flugelhorns together. The Bach trumpet has a lot more fans than the Bach flugelhorn. This is reversed (and to a lesser degree) for the Conn. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Brad361
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 7080
Location: Houston, TX.
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 5:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LittleRusty wrote: | So you are questioning your choice of horns and are looking to validate your current horn by soliciting opinions?
There is a reason why Bach is top dog.
There is a reason why other brands of horns continue to be sold.
Rather than validating your experience with a bunch of strangers, ask your audience how they like the sound of you playing on the vintage 1. |
Ok, valid, but as this IS a horn forum, I see nothing wrong with the o.p. question. And btw, don't know about you, but the audiences I play for generally are a bunch of strangers as well. But I understand your statement, ask people in FRONT of the horn about sound, ok, fair enough.
Plus the guy is new here, I'd prefer to give him the impression that this is a friendly discussion forum, as long as he stays within the rule structure. Which, so far, he has.
_________________
When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
plp
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 7023
Location: South Alabama
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 5:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| hansonsf wrote: | Here is the horn that Vincent Bach copied with the Strad 37. I played a Strad 25 for over a quarter century, but I prefer this one. If I only could have one horn this would be it.
1927 CONN 2B New World Symphony
Click. Copy URL. Paste in a new tab (window) to see full size |
The TRUE Vintage One, IMOHO. My 1929 plays right up there with anything, but is very unforgiving if you aren't dead on the money. I prefer the newer Vintage One for tone over the Strads, but all else seems very similar. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hien peter
Veteran Member
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 307
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:40 am Post subject: a |
|
|
I really really love my Strad-37.
It is such a versatile horn for me,
and gives me everthing I demand from a trumpet.
My neighbour has a golden CV1.
In my oppinion this CV1 is a boring trumpet.
I would never buy this one.
peter
_________________
playing trumpet is like meditation
Strad H37 & G 7s
martin committee 1946
Weimann C, Strad C
Conn V1 FH & MB6 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rich G
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Posts: 2998
Location: Connecticut
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Pablo3 wrote: | I do own a Vintage One, I chose it over the Bach, i just found the Bach to be fuzzy & over-rated. I really liked the sound of the Conn, the design, and the package it came with.
I'm just interested in others opinions of the two.
thanks. |
When someone asks a "what's your take... compared to" question about a horn after they've already purchased it, I can't help but think that they are looking for validation (reassurance that they made the right decision) rather than discussion.
But here goes based upon my experiences owning three Conn Vintage Ones and several Strads. BTW, I never played any horn that was "fuzzy" - unless I had too many single malts - then they all sounded "fuzzy". (I think "fuzziness" is a characteristic of the player - not the horn... or am I confusing that with "buzziness")???
All 3 Conn V1's were the same ML model with 46 leadpipe. One of the V1's was an outstanding horn - the other two were among the worst pro horns I ever played. Every one of the V1's had construction problems (braces falling off) and/or plating issues.
It was also puzzling why the tuning slide on my V1 would not fit my student's identical V1 model. BTW, my student swapped his V1 three times at Sam Ash because the silverplating was wearing off after two months - leaving brass spots showing through. The best playing of the V1's he had was the first one. His last one had excellent plating but was not the best playing horn of the 3. He sold it, and is now playing a Strad 37 that he loves (and sounds great on).
I have never played trumpets from any manufacturer (including Bach)that varied so much in feel and response from one horn to the next than the Conn V1, or that had so many quality control issues.
As for comparing the Conn V1 to the Strad, I've compared every horn I ever owned to the Strad because possibly the best horn I ever owned was a ML bore Strad 72* in lacquer/nickel finish made in 1995. That 72* was better than the MV and Bronx Strads I owned, and the Lawlers, and a Harrelson I owned. If there were any horns I owned that were on a par with that 72* Strad it was my Schilke B4 and B6 and my current Strad 38 M bore, and Calicchio 1S/7.
Never played a Strad or Conn V1 flugel. Completely satisfied with my Kanstul French Besson Brevete flugel. Though the best sounding flugel I ever owned was a 1930's Buescher that I (sigh) sold to a collector.
But, honestly, who cares what horn any of us play? It doesn't matter to me if someone is not happy with the horns I like and play. That's not going to stop me from playing what I like. I'm happy with them based upon my personal experience with the horn and the feedback I get from people whose ears I trust.
_________________
"I tried practicing for a few weeks, and ended up playing too fast." Paul Desmond |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hien peter
Veteran Member
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 307
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:32 am Post subject: a |
|
|
see www.brassreview.com
_________________
playing trumpet is like meditation
Strad H37 & G 7s
martin committee 1946
Weimann C, Strad C
Conn V1 FH & MB6 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pfeifela
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Apr 2006
Posts: 1280
Location: Portland, Oregon
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
IMHO the Vintage One is among (perhaps the most) underrated horn around, and often a great value depending on what you paid.
_________________
Larry Pfeifer |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dr_trumpet
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Nov 2001
Posts: 2533
Location: Cope, IN
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 10:05 am Post subject: Re: C.G. Conn Vs. Bach Strad |
|
|
| Pablo3 wrote: | What is your take on the C.G.Conn "Vintage One" Series?
Trumpet and Flugelhorn editions.
Perhaps compaired to Bach horns??? |
I own an early V1 Rose Brass Bell Bb trumpet, and a slightly custom Rose Brass Bell V1 flugel in silver.
Neither horn will likely ever leave my possession, unless a student who is really promising wants the trumpet badly. The flugelhorn is not for sale, never will be. It is the best flugel I've EVER played. The trumpet is a very good horn, but I have a couple around here I prefer to it. I bought it cheap and hold on to it until I tire of it taking up space, or a student REALLY wants it bad. It is a very fine horn, I've just got two I like better. (Monette 149XL, Bach LB 72 bell)
Al
_________________
Dr. Albert L. Lilly, III DM
Artist/Clinician for Vincent Bach Trumpets (Conn-Selmer)
Principal Trumpet, Hendricks Symphony (Avon, IN)
Arranger/Composer; Lilly Music |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jazz_trpt
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Nov 2001
Posts: 5734
Location: Savoy, Illinois, USA
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I've played a V1 trumpet and flugel for several years and love them both.
I wouldn't say that the V1 trumpet is better than a Bach strad, just different.
The flugel is, in my opinion, much, much better than the Strad flugels that I've played, and records very nicely.
_________________
Jeff Helgesen
Free jazz solo transcriptions! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jhatpro
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002
Posts: 10204
Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 10:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | But, honestly, who cares what horn any of us play? It doesn't matter to me if someone is not happy with the horns I like and play. That's not going to stop me from playing what I like. I'm happy with them based upon my personal experience with the horn and the feedback I get from people whose ears I trust.
|
That has to be one of the best observations ever posted on TH.
_________________
Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bilboinsa
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 Dec 2005
Posts: 3378
Location: San Antonio, TX
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| hansonsf wrote: | Here is the horn that Vincent Bach copied with the Strad 37. I played a Strad 25 for over a quarter century, but I prefer this one. If I only could have one horn this would be it.
1927 CONN 2B New World Symphony
Click. Copy URL. Paste in a new tab (window) to see full size |
Really? Is that true--the copying part?
To the OP, I have played the V1 flug and loved it. It was my second choice for a warm, mellow sound. I also love the wooden trigger tip (silly, I know, but...) I did not like the V1 trumpet as much as I did the flug. It is a very very personal choice, though...
Good luck.
_________________
Doug Walsdorf
Schilke B2;
Kanstul 1525;
1927 Conn 22B
1970 B&H Regent
"In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit...it was a hobbit-hole, and that means comfort."
http://www.myspace.com/schilkeb2
Member: http://xeml.buglesacrossamerica.org/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hansonsf
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 670
|
| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| bilboinsa wrote: | | hansonsf wrote: | 1927 CONN 2B New World Symphony
Here is the horn that Vincent Bach copied with the Strad 37. |
Really? Is that true--the copying part? |
Apparently true. Give this a read:
http://www.bradgoode.com/Blogs/2/60/
I've heard this from others, but this was the one I could put my hands on quickest. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
