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Tobias Veteran Member
Joined: 13 Mar 2006 Posts: 406 Location: Germany
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2009 2:27 pm Post subject: Byrdlike or Birdlike ??? |
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Hi,
there's a blues in F written by Freddie Hubbard.
Is the title Birdlike or Byrdlike?
In fakebooks and on recordings i saw both of them.
Is it a tribute to Bird or to Donald Byrd?
Thanks!
Tobias _________________ Conn Connstellation 38b
Olds Special (1954)
Getzen Eterna
Flgh Bach Strad 183
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCu_ROyOxKhTAa_45c8H93lQ |
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PH Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator
Joined: 26 Nov 2001 Posts: 5860 Location: New Albany, Indiana
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2009 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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The original recording says Birdlike. _________________ Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Clinical Professor of Jazz Trumpet, University of Illinois
Professor Emeritus of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops 1976-2019
JazzRetreats.com |
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Def Trumpet Veteran Member
Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Posts: 357 Location: MI
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 5:51 am Post subject: |
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Tribute to Charlie Parker. _________________ '50s Martin Committee M Bore
NY Bach Strad 42
MV Bach Strad 37
ACB 3CS |
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rusco Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2004 Posts: 87
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NTlead Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Nov 2003 Posts: 1136 Location: Philadelphia
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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Given the nature of the head, Byrdlike would make more sense, but I've only ever seen Birdlike. Seems like an awfully odd melody with which to pay homage to Charlie Parker. |
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Def Trumpet Veteran Member
Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Posts: 357 Location: MI
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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Huh, I swear I remember hearing somewhere that Hubbard had Parker in mind when he wrote the song.
Here's a Jazztimes article that backs me up.
"On his 1961 album, Ready for Freddie, Hubbard unveiled “Birdlike,” his tribute to Charlie Parker, with a bravura trumpet solo that machine-gunned notes across several octaves at a dizzying, Parker-like tempo pushed along by Elvin Jones. Each note, whether a piercing 16th or a bluesy quarter, was precisely pitched and crisply articulated." _________________ '50s Martin Committee M Bore
NY Bach Strad 42
MV Bach Strad 37
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rusco Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2004 Posts: 87
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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NTlead wrote: | Given the nature of the head, Byrdlike would make more sense, but I've only ever seen Birdlike. Seems like an awfully odd melody with which to pay homage to Charlie Parker. |
Agreed. I see both points. There are parts of the melody that could be "Parker"esque. but on the other hand, changes that are more hard-bopish.
Let's all get together, hold hands and ask Freddie himself... |
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rusco Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2004 Posts: 87
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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K,
Now I'm REALLY confused....
I went back and read the liner note for Ready for Freddie and it does make mention of Charlie Parker
".... aside from the Charlie Parker-like nature of the angular theme, the ryhthmic felling throughout is rooted in Bird's Language...."
I remember asking this question in a masterclass to Christian McBride who played with Freddie back in the 90's. He made referance to Donald Byrd.
Let's consult Wilmer Wise.... he'll know. |
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rusco Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2004 Posts: 87
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, Ya got me thinkin.
this is kinda like who wrote Donna Lee? Bird or Miles. Miles swears up and down in his autobiograhpy he wrote it, but clearly it's not a "Bird" -like (no pun intnded) melody.
hhhhmmmmm
Last edited by rusco on Thu May 14, 2009 9:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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PRogers Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Sep 2004 Posts: 953
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 7:38 am Post subject: |
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I'd say its pretty clear that Donna Lee was not written by Bird. It really doesn't have the same phraseology nor rhythmic ingenuity of Bird, to my ears at least. |
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EricM224 Veteran Member
Joined: 29 Dec 2005 Posts: 274
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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The original title is Birdlike, a tribute to "Bird". However, when Freddie went to record that tune with another group he changed the title to Byrdlike to avaiod copywrite problems. I could be wrong! But on Ready for Freddie it's "Birdlike" and on all the V.S.O.P. records it's "Byrdlike". Who knows!
Cheers
Eric _________________ Bach Trumpet Artist - Clinician
Assistant Professor of Trumpet
University of Louisiana at Monroe
www.ericsiereveldmusic.com |
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kfjazz Regular Member
Joined: 30 Jul 2008 Posts: 43
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2-5-1 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 21 Nov 2006 Posts: 1381
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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PRogers wrote: | I'd say its pretty clear that Donna Lee was not written by Bird. It really doesn't have the same phraseology nor rhythmic ingenuity of Bird, to my ears at least. |
I've had this arguement with a lot of musicians. I've transcribed a lot of bird, and Donna Lee has hardly any of the typical Parker-ism's (and there are ALOT). I totally believe that Miles wrote it, in fact, I've always wondered if he wrote it as an excercise...It plays like an etude... _________________ www.mikesailorsmusic.com |
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rusco Regular Member
Joined: 26 Dec 2004 Posts: 87
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds like we've found the answer. Thanks kf! Killer tune! |
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nospacebar14 Regular Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2008 Posts: 20 Location: Michigan
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Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 8:59 am Post subject: |
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I agree -- Donna Lee does not sound like a bird tune. There's no larger rhythm to the phrases like on most bird tunes. |
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Dr. Stu Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 Jul 2004 Posts: 651 Location: New York, N.Y.
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Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 10:17 am Post subject: |
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On "Ready for Freddie" it is Birdlike, & I always assumed it was for Parker & that "Byrdlike" was a typical Fake-Book misspelling. Awesome find, that Youtube clip, kind of removes all doubt!
I guess a deliberate change to avoid "copyright problems" could make sense too.
Now perhaps we can tackle the reason it is Freddie & not Freddy.
-Stu |
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