Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10209 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:00 am Post subject: Finally Got It!
Not dubba C but dubba G, my long-time goal! (Figured it was time to get serious about it 'cause the community jazz band I just joined passed out Kenton's "Peanut Vendor" and the 2nd tpt part goes to G above high C! Yikes!)
Anyway, I've been taking lessons from a terrific teacher, working diligently on Stamp, Bai Lin, Concone, Vizzutti, and more. And I've tripled my daily practice from 30 to 90 minutes plus.
In addition, I've been really zeroing in on using tongue arch to speed up my air above the staff.
So today I opened up my cigar box full of mouthpieces and lined up all the potential high-register candidates including Laskey 70S, Hammond 4S, Yamaha Shew Lead, Marcink Shew 1 Lead, Warburton 3S with a NY BB, and Najoom 3C/S with the NY BB.
Both the Shews closed down on me. Most of the rest got me to E above high C okay. Only the Najoom 3C/S with the NY BB got me to G!
My strategy was to get comfortable with an E, F, F#, G arpeggio in the staff and then an octave above and then into the promised land. I tanked up with plenty of air, kept my tongue forward and high, backed off a bit, and blew.
It worked! All four notes in the highest arpeggio came out clear as anything.
As a 68-year old who's been playing (and coveting high notes) since 1952, I'm feeling pretty good! Unless I can get to Dubba C in the meantime, this is going on my stone! _________________ Jim Hatfield
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10209 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:10 pm Post subject:
My termimology may be faulty. The note I finally reached is G above high C. If that isn't Dubba G then I don't know what to call it. _________________ Jim Hatfield
Joined: 05 Sep 2007 Posts: 320 Location: Central Florida
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 11:50 am Post subject:
A cigar box of mouthpieces to see which will get you the highest?? My guess is that you are not a pro or even an active, practising amateur. You are definitely going about it the wrong way. You need a good, solid middle of the road piece that gives you a good tone and WORK with it. Remember, those notes you are so happy for - Hi C to G above - require a lot more wind. Blow out the end of your horn, not just into the mouthpiece. Go as high as you can without forcing it, and be careful not to hurt yourself by tryng too much too soon or you'll crash and burn. I'm 75 and I can do what you want to do, with an ordinary stock Warburton 4M/7BB, which is in the 3C ballpark. _________________ So many trumpets and mouthpieces, so little time.
A cigar box of mouthpieces to see which will get you the highest?? My guess is that you are not a pro or even an active, practising amateur. You are definitely going about it the wrong way. You need a good, solid middle of the road piece that gives you a good tone and WORK with it. Remember, those notes you are so happy for - Hi C to G above - require a lot more wind. Blow out the end of your horn, not just into the mouthpiece. Go as high as you can without forcing it, and be careful not to hurt yourself by tryng too much too soon or you'll crash and burn. I'm 75 and I can do what you want to do, with an ordinary stock Warburton 4M/7BB, which is in the 3C ballpark.
I usually don't get involved with these kinds of discussions, but almost every statement in the above quote is, for what should be very obvious reasons, completely uncalled for.
And Jim - first - congrats! It's always wonderful to have breakthroughs in the things we work on, isn't it?
and 2nd...a dubba G is just a verrryyyyy flat dubba C....keep at it - you'll get it up in tune! _________________ Tim Wendt
I usually don't get involved with these kinds of discussions, but almost every statement in the above quote is, for what should be very obvious reasons, completely uncalled for.
Joined: 05 Sep 2007 Posts: 320 Location: Central Florida
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 12:29 pm Post subject:
Gee- and I thought that getting him off the box of mouthpieces monkey on his back was doing him a favor. _________________ So many trumpets and mouthpieces, so little time.
Gee- and I thought that getting him off the box of mouthpieces monkey on his back was doing him a favor.
For some people, the one-or-two mouthpieces for everything works. Greg Wing, Professor of Trumpet at Morehead State University, for one. He's used the same Schilke 15 for over 30 years.
Then there's Lew Soloff and his changing of pieces during tunes. check out 5:03 in the vid, and again at 5:26:
My personal take on pieces is always use the right tool for the job. As I play in a huge variety of situations and play in all the chairs and play with a lot of different players, I'll use what I think is the best for me to do my best, given the situation.
For example, when I played Lead for Aretha Franklin a few weeks ago, I used a certain piece that fit that situation. It most certainly was not the same piece I used a few nights ago on the 1st book on a special concert performance of "Brigadoon" at the Shubert Theater in NYC. _________________ Tim Wendt
Joined: 05 Sep 2007 Posts: 320 Location: Central Florida
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 1:57 pm Post subject:
I must cofess I speak with experience when criticizing numerous mouthpiece changes. As a kid I started on clarinet and disliked changing reeds, so I switched to the trumpet, with only one mouthpiece. Hah! - most trumpet players I know have boxes or even drawers full of them. Over the years I have been as guilty as anyone, trying any new thing to be higher and louder.I was lucky enough not to permanently destroy my chops, tho' I came close more than once. It took years to learn to pretty much stick with with as little change as possible.That's why when this Poster mentioned "going into his box of mouthpieces" and trying each to see how he could force out high notes I felt I had to throw in my opinion. At his age he could hurt himself and never play again.
Yes, some really good professional players do change a lot but I'll bet it's ruined many others. Pee Wee Irwin played a raw brass 7C for almost 50 years and Dizzy Gillespie played with puffed out cheeks, proving there's always an exception, but the vast majority of us can't do that. _________________ So many trumpets and mouthpieces, so little time.
Joined: 09 Oct 2006 Posts: 2548 Location: Oakville, ON Canada
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:02 pm Post subject:
I'm with Tim on this.
Congrats on achieving your goal! _________________ Schilke B1
Callet Jazz
Scodwell Standard Bb
Roger Ingram 1600is
Wild Thing Flugel
Dillon Rotary Picc.
GR and Curry Mouthpieces
I must cofess I speak with experience when criticizing numerous mouthpiece changes. As a kid I started on clarinet and disliked changing reeds, so I switched to the trumpet, with only one mouthpiece. Hah! - most trumpet players I know have boxes or even drawers full of them. Over the years I have been as guilty as anyone, trying any new thing to be higher and louder.I was lucky enough not to permanently destroy my chops, tho' I came close more than once. It took years to learn to pretty much stick with with as little change as possible.That's why when this Poster mentioned "going into his box of mouthpieces" and trying each to see how he could force out high notes I felt I had to throw in my opinion. At his age he could hurt himself and never play again.
Yes, some really good professional players do change a lot but I'll bet it's ruined many others. Pee Wee Irwin played a raw brass 7C for almost 50 years and Dizzy Gillespie played with puffed out cheeks, proving there's always an exception, but the vast majority of us can't do that.
It's the way you said it, not the the content of your orig. post. Go back and read it. You sound like a jerk.
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10209 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:33 pm Post subject:
Quote:
A cigar box of mouthpieces to see which will get you the highest?? My guess is that you are not a pro or even an active, practising amateur. You are definitely going about it the wrong way.
Hey, why kick sand on my castle? No, I'm not a pro, but I'm a very active, very committed amateur. I started lessons with a local teacher in Iowa in 1952 and, since then, I've studied with a lot of very talented trumpet player/teachers including Don Ellis and Brad Goode and taken single lessons or master classes with Bobby Shew, Scott Wendholt, Jim Rotondi, Pat Harbison, Roger Ingram, Chase Sanborn, and Pops McLaughlin. I'm currently studying with Lev Garbar, a graduate of Mannes and a very talented orchestral player/teacher.
I normally play a Laskey C cup and went to the shallower Najoom cup and Warburton backbore as an experiment, one that seemed to work pretty well. I won't be using it for everything but it may help me reach the heights on "Peanut Vendor."
As for the switching mouthpieces: it seems to work for Lew Soloff, Doc Severinsen, and a whole lot of other great players. So, sand back at ya, bud. I may not be a pro but I sure am a committed amateur!
Finally, thanks to those of you who offered congrats. In trumpet playing, as in golf, it's nice to hear "Great shot!" once in a while. _________________ Jim Hatfield
I must cofess I speak with experience when criticizing numerous mouthpiece changes.
please don't get me wrong - I did not say the information you posted was incorrect or wrong, only that the way you presented it was "completely uncalled for."
IMO it was demeaning and very confrontational, very like you were chastising a young child for doing something against your wishes. If you'll do the math, you and Jim are only 7 years apart in age.
As I said, I'll change / use what's best for me for the situation. I used to play everything on only one piece, and many times had to work my tokus off to do it. Then I adopted the "right tool for the job" approach, and ever since my playing has greatly improved and is much easier to do. I do practice with different pieces so that when I have to do it for money it's an easy transition, and everyone is happy.
A quick story - one Sunday morning, in my 10 1/2 years as Principal / Lead / Featured Solo Trumpet on the Crystal Cathedral's "Hour of Power" TV show, the MD brought in an extra trumpet player to my 3-man section. This guy was a part-time, every-other-weekend amateur player at best. Happened to be a morning when we were backing the Canadian Brass.
I was told "He'll sit next to you, let him play some of the 1st parts."
OK. MD sez to do it means ya gotta do it.
He was using a Bach 1 1/2 C, which to my ears was not the right piece for his abilities. We're playing a chart w/ the Brass and the part on our stand, after a few bars rest, went up to a high C.
My "assistant" pulls out a Schilke 14A4a, makes the switch...and didn't move his tuning slide.
There was nothing I could do about it except, when the MD heard the sound from my section, I made sure he could tell it was NOT me playing.
Anyway, back to Jim. Jim, years ago Scott Laskey at Schilke gave me some great advice about range. I was peaking out on a dubba G# that more often than not wasn't there, if ya know what I mean. My G was solid as a rock, but the G#... not so much so. Scott said the reason could be because I was thinking "up" to the note. He suggested thinking of it as an Ab, that way I'd be thinking "down" to the note.
It's the old "sharps raise / flats lower" concept.
Told me that after the Ab became solid and when I wanted to play an "A" to think of eliminating the flat - I was already on a "A" of sorts with the Ab, so taking away the flat was a simple thing to do.
It all made sense. It did take a while to get my brain switched around to that way of thinking, but ever since, it has worked for me. Hopefully it can work for you. _________________ Tim Wendt
Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 4313 Location: Ithaca NY
Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 3:15 pm Post subject:
Well, I am just an amateur as well, and I also congratulate jhatpro for reaching a note yet beyond my reach. I do wonder if one of the issues with changing mps is the THINKING part. I have found switching isn't too much of an issue for me if I just focus on playing and forget what piece I stuck in the horn. When I begin to "consider" what might happen with a switch I feel that I open myself to problems which might remain dormant if I just play the damn things.
That said, I am in negotiation to unload 12 pieces from my accumulation in trade/cash for one I do want, and maybe I will be better off if the potential selection is reduced thereby.
asher _________________ veery715
Hear me sing!: https://youtu.be/vtJ14MV64WY
Playing trumpet - the healthy way to blow your brains out.
Joined: 07 Jan 2009 Posts: 1248 Location: Vacaville CA
Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 1:09 am Post subject:
Congratulations on the "high G" !!!
Don't worry about the mouthpiece stuff... If your using a comfortable mouthpiece that is "HELPING" to give you the sound you want, play it !!! The mouthpiece will not give you anything you don't already have, it will just make it easier... _________________ Jeff Garrett
Playing "G" Soprano Bugle, Freelancers Alumni/Mini Corps
NorCal Horn Line Instructor/Musical Arranger
Kanstul G Soprano (Powerbore Bell)
Yamaha YTR-739T
Xtream XZ w/ XXX backbore GREAT MP!!!
http://freelancers-alumni.org
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
