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Capt.Kirk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Feb 2009 Posts: 5792
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Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:23 pm Post subject: lOOKING FOR IMAGES OF ODD WRAP GETZEN FLUGEL |
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I had an image of an Old Seldom seen Getzen Flugel it looked like a Getzen Cornet but almost but had a 6 1/2 inch bell and was in fact a Flugel. I wanted to save the image because I thought it was so cool and not at all like the current FLugel wrap in fashion. I am sure it had terrible intonation based on the design and the large bore trumpet/cornet valve assembly. If they could re-do it with what they know today about the critical dimensions and where they are it sure would be cool to have something that looked and handled physically more like a cornet or trumpet. I am not a huge fan of the wrap of Flugels and how you have to hold them. If the wrap style is not critical and I think Andy Taylor has shown wrap to be rather flexible it would be nice to have something like that design only re-imagined with today's knowledge base and profile details.
At any rate I would love to have a copy of the image I could save again if anyone has a link to it!
Thanks! _________________ The only easy day was yesterday! |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8348 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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Are you sure you don't mean the old Bach Flugel? That had a cornet wrap.
_________________ LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
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Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn |
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nordlandstrompet Veteran Member
Joined: 05 Apr 2008 Posts: 266 Location: Norway
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Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:04 pm Post subject: |
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Schilke had the trumpet wrap....
_________________ Nordlands
http://www.brassnor.no
CarolBrass Scandinavia
---------------------------
Taylor
Chicago Custom X-VR
Chicago Gen III
CarolBrass
CTR-5200V-(D)-L
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Capt.Kirk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Feb 2009 Posts: 5792
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Posted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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No, but I do like the Bach odd wrap. Never played one or herd that style though. If they could make it play good I would would own one in a made minute. I am not a big flugel guy since I came back to the USA. I love the sound just have no invested in one. TO be honest even though I will likely end up with a perinet valve flugel I would prob. be more comfortable with a rotary since that is what I am most familiar with " Go beer tents go" lol....
I have to admit I hate the wrap in fashion now. I do not like how you have to hold them at all it is not a very comfortable position really!!!
Really their is no reason you need to stick with that wrap so long as each branch has the same dimensions in the same place and the bell profile remains unchanged you can wrap it any way you want with in reason and not have too much issue one way or the other. If Taylor can make a Bb trumpet like his Vulcan and his phatboy flugel then their is plenty of room for a tighter wrap with more ergonomic playing position and package.
A few years ago their was a Getzen Flugel that looked very cornet like it had the look of a Tone Balanced Cornet but the bell profile was all wrong and all te tubing was slightly larger and different looking. It was as odd looking as that Bach though. It was listed on Ebay I think improperly and had a 6.5 inch bell and it was the same bore size I think as the trumpets. I think it was 50 or 60-ish because it had the same valve assembly design as the Tone Balanced Deluxe with all the copper and nickel trim.....I have only ever seen it one time. I accidentally deleted a bunch of files. It looked like a Getzen Cornet on "STEROIDS". Unless Getzen made a Bass Bb Tone Ballanced Deluxe Cornet it was a Flugel.
In fact if you look at Taylor and CarolBrass's pocket trumpets their is no reason you could not do something similar not quite as extreme but similar to a FLugel if their was a demand for it. _________________ The only easy day was yesterday! |
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Capt.Kirk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Feb 2009 Posts: 5792
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Posted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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Never played a Schilke flugel from that time frame either. I heard they where not so hot but again it is not the wrap rather it is the dimensions of the tubing. I do think a longer leadpipe run though on any instrument is always better then a shorter one in relationship to how soon it enters the valve assembly. I think rotary C,Bb,E etc.... trumpets should have their leadpipe on the other side of the valve assembly so they can be almost twice as long before entering the valve assembly. _________________ The only easy day was yesterday! |
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oxleyk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 4180
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8348 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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CRoberts8 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 834 Location: Chicago, IL
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Posted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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On the same theme...my NY Bach model 158 flugelhorn. Later became the model 165 in Mt. Vernon and the model 182 in Elkhart.
Good luck finding info on the horn you are asking about.
_________________ Charles Russell Roberts
Trumpet, Gaudete Brass Quintet
www.gaudetebrass.com |
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Bob Stevenson Heavyweight Member
Joined: 04 May 2005 Posts: 1139 Location: Essex, England
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Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:29 am Post subject: |
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I've long been intersted in this type of flugle. This seems such a better shape for brass band work where it's 'physical' for two hours at a time,...it must be MUCH nicer to hold....
..........However, Andy Taylor once made a 'cornet type flugle' before he started 'Taylor Trumpets' in Norwich. As I remember he called his operation 'Bellman Brass' or similar and I met him at a London music exhibition where all he had on the table was a trumpet and the cornet flugle. I asked him about it several years later and he told me that he considered there was no future in that design. |
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VetPsychWars Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 7196 Location: Greenfield WI
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Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:04 am Post subject: |
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Crazy Finn wrote: | oxleyk wrote: | There was the Buescher True Tone that had a cornet wrap. |
Here's a nice photo thanks to Google:
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WANT!!
(ahem)
Tom _________________ 1950 Buescher Lightweight 400 Trumpet
1949 Buescher 400 Trumpet
1939 Buescher 400 Cornet
GR65M, GR65 Cor #1 |
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plunkett Heavyweight Member
Joined: 05 Jun 2002 Posts: 564 Location: Wheeling, WV
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Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:18 am Post subject: |
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Getzen makes a lot of "marching brass" - I suspect this may be what we're seeing here (at least in part).
Pat _________________ Pat Plunkett |
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Paul_Merrill New Member
Joined: 05 Jun 2021 Posts: 1
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Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 6:47 am Post subject: The Getzen Fluget |
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I just purchased the instrument in question. It is a cornet body with a flugelhorn bell and factory-made by Getzen. There are no records of this horn so it is likely a pre-fire experiment.
I gave up trying to post an image on this site so here is the URL
[/url]https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ONJcGqBv2ZNxfEAZm-tYBfP8AW6BAOLr/view?usp=sharing[/url] _________________ Paul Merrill
Holton T105
Adams F4 Flugel
Getzen Fluget |
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huntman10 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Aug 2017 Posts: 721 Location: Texas South Plains
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Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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I was not able to see the Buescher flug pic, but assume it was made after the 60's merger with Bach/Selmer, and followed the late Mt. Vernon/early Elkhart "cornet wrap" shown by Crazy Finn, but with a smaller diameter first branch. Bundy produced more of these in the 70's, and I have owned 4 over the years. To my less than discriminating palate, they played and felt very much like my '71 Getzen 4 valve flug, as did the older Mt. Vernon 158 I had a brief fling with about 20 years ago. All these have ML bore valvesets ( as does my friend's absurdly rare 1987 Monette flugelhorn i am presently holding for him) that seems to affect their overall "blow".
I have also seen the older Getzen large bell "flug-cornet", and it seems likely to me that it should play very much like the Martin Custom (or Magna, or Committee, or Imperial) that had 0.468" bores, and a much slower flair than other flugs. Playing that flugelhorn, to me, was like playing a soprano Bb mellophone!! That is just a guess, based on a 60 year compulsion to try everything that has a cup mouthpiece Bd 3 or more valves. _________________ huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc. |
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Crazy Finn Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Dec 2001 Posts: 8348 Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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huntman10 wrote: | I was not able to see the Buescher flug pic, but assume it was made after the 60's merger with Bach/Selmer, and followed the late Mt. Vernon/early Elkhart "cornet wrap" shown by Crazy Finn, but with a smaller diameter first branch. |
No, it was a Buescher original design, and predated it's acquisition by Selmer.
http://www.buescherloyalist.com/Buescher%20280%20Flugelhorn.html _________________ LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn |
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Uberopa Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Dec 2003 Posts: 935 Location: Canada
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Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:26 am Post subject: |
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I once owned a Donald E. Getzen Caravelle flugel It had the same wrap as the early Holton and Conns with a curved leadpipe. |
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spitvalve Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 2193 Location: Little Elm, TX
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Posted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 1:47 pm Post subject: Re: The Getzen Fluget |
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Paul_Merrill wrote: | I just purchased the instrument in question. It is a cornet body with a flugelhorn bell and factory-made by Getzen. There are no records of this horn so it is likely a pre-fire experiment.
I gave up trying to post an image on this site so here is the URL
[/url]https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ONJcGqBv2ZNxfEAZm-tYBfP8AW6BAOLr/view?usp=sharing[/url] |
That is a very interesting-looking horn. Hope you'll post a review after you play it. _________________ Bryan Fields
----------------
1991 Bach LR180 ML 37S
1999 Getzen Eterna 700S
1977 Getzen Eterna 895S Flugelhorn
1969 Getzen Capri cornet
1995 UMI Benge 4PSP piccolo trumpet
Warburton and Stomvi Flex mouthpieces |
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huntman10 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Aug 2017 Posts: 721 Location: Texas South Plains
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Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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One of the Getzens showed on eBay.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Getzen-Fluget-Flugelhorn-Cornet-/203513517413?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m2548.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0 _________________ huntman10
Collector/Player of Fine (and not so fine) Brass Instruments including
Various Strads, Yammies, Al Hirt Courtois, Schilkes,
Selmer 25, Getzen Eternas, Kanstuls (920 Pic, CG)
Martin Custom Large Bore, Lots Olds!, Conns, etc. |
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